Return to David's theory of evolution (Evolution)

by David Turell , Monday, November 07, 2022, 17:40 (745 days ago) @ dhw

DAVID: You keep forgetting your agreement God can do whatever He wishes. The history of evolution with its dead ends is what God produced on His way to the creation of humans.

dhw: You keep deliberately leaving out your fixed beliefs (which are not facts) that 1) he individually designed every dead-end life form, ecosystem, natural wonder etc. that had no connection with us and our food, in spite of the fact that 2) his only purpose was to create us and our food. And you keep forgetting that if he can do whatever he wishes, it is totally illogical for him to “have to do” 1) as an “absolute requirement” if he is to achieve 2).

God decides what He has to do. I'm sure you accept that point. Therefore, the dead ends you complain about are God-produced from His method of evolution, which has Him design all forms and provide ecosystems to feed them along the way in time.

DAVID: Living forms run on biologic systems. The Ediacaran biologic systems are the basis for the phenotypic Cambrian changes in form, but not living biology which is continuous.

dhw: I don’t understand the second sentence. If Ediacaran “biological systems” provided the basis for new species, then we have continuity. Evolution’s history is that of living forms and biological systems changing into new forms and systems, so why do you say “not living biology"? What you have described IS living biology, and upholds the conventional view of evolution.

DAVID: I'll try again: the biochemistry that makes life is one aspect of evolution. The second aspect is the form of the living organisms. Ediacaran biochemistry is the biochemical basis for Cambrian forms. The continuity of evolution is in the underling biochemistry which then allows for/permits the changing phenotypic forms.

dhw: Yes, yes, all living things share the same biochemistry which allows for evolution. And evolution is the history of the changing “phenotypic” forms. But that does not mean that we humans and our food are the direct descendants of the brontosaurus. The history of the changing forms is one of countless branches, the majority of which did not lead to us and our food, even though they all use the biochemistry of life. Your statement of the obvious does not answer the point I made yesterday: You cannot claim that there is a continuous line from the first life forms to us and our ecosystems and at the same time claim that we and our ecosystems are descended from a line of life forms and ecosystems that had no predecessors!

Again confusing the relationship of phenotypes with evolutionary biochemistry. The two are separate parts of evolution. We can trace our start from the first vertebrate fish in the Cambrian which is based on the biochemistry from the Ediacaran. A designer obviously can jump form types. The continuity is the living biochemistry.

DAVID: The Cambrian is based upon the Ediacaran. That is evolution!!!!

dhw: Exactly! So why do you keep telling us that your God designed the 37 phyla from which we and our food (plus lots more dead ends) have descended, and they had no predecessors? Without predecessors you cannot have continuity!

DAVID: But there is continuity in the biochemistry.

dhw: That does not mean we and our food are descended from every plant and animal that ever existed, and therefore it is nonsense to claim that your God designed every plant and animal that ever existed because they were all necessary for him to design us and our food. And if we are descended from phenotypic forms which your God designed in the Cambrian without predecessors, we cannot be descended from any forms that existed before the Cambrian!

You are so confused without God. As designer He can do what He wishes. You are right. We come from Cambrian forms. Your strawman is that we come from nowhere. Preposterous!!! We are here and Archaea bacteria are the start of life. You cannot tear apart those facts, much as you are flailing around trying to do so.