Return to David's theory of evolution PARTS 1 & 2 (Evolution)

by dhw, Tuesday, March 22, 2022, 18:22 (975 days ago) @ David Turell

DAVID: The only view of God it is logical to have is humans were God's purpose

dhw: And yet you cannot understand why he chose to design all those life forms and foods that had no connection with humans. You even go so far as to tell us “God makes sense only to himself. He has reasons we may not understand.” How wonderful to know that the only logical view is one which doesn’t make sense to us humans!

DAVID: Same distortion: I don't need to know why God chose to evolve us. Only you do.

There is no distortion! You don’t know why, if we were your God’s only purpose, he didn’t choose to create us directly, and you don’t know why he chose to design countless life forms and foods that had no connection with us. But you don’t need to know. You are happy to cling to beliefs that make no sense to you.

DAVID (from the “brain” thread:) We are a purposeful creation, with God not doing it for His own emotional needs.

dhw: I keep repeating that I do not regard God as being “needy”.. I am happy with your agreement that he enjoys creating, and therefore by extension it is possible that he creates because he wants to do something he enjoys.

DAVID: Stop distorting! God does not need to create to produce enjoyment! Vastly different from your statement.

The distortion is yours. I keep rejecting the word “need” (as bolded above), and my comment relates to your statements “We’ve agreed he must enjoy it” and “God didn’t necessarily do it to please himself”. The latter indicates that it is possible he did do it to please himself, and that is all I ask, since all my different proposals – just like yours - are unprovable theories
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DAVID: God evolves all steps from Big Bang to humans. His method of choice.

I have never disputed that if God exists, he would have designed the system by which all life forms evolved, including humans and countless species unconnected with humans, other than through the fact that they were all “biochemical”.

DAVID: Yes, biochemical. Necessary simple biochemical processes were designed first, which underlies all phenotypical changes later.

But you have your God specially designing every individual species, although he only wanted to design one species plus its food, and you don’t know why, because God makes sense only to Himself.

DAVID: […] I read authorities on how to think about God.

dhw: I’m amazed to hear that anyone has the “authority” on how to think about God, and I would be equally amazed to hear that these “authorities” claimed…[no need for me to repeat your whole theory of evolution, which apparently only God can understand.]

DAVID: Did you ever study theistic views of God which show you how to view God for yourself?

This is a new dodge. Let’s ignore the arguments and focus on what dhw hasn’t read. He needs to read books which tell him how to think for himself!! Now please tell me if all the books you have read provide you with exactly the same opinions on how to view your God. Don’t any of them disagree with one another? Are all religions identical? Do all of them accept your theory of evolution which only God can understand?

David believes that God deliberately designed life as a “constant war to survive by eating”
dhw: According to you, his only purpose was to design humans plus our food. Why, then, did he design all these different life forms in such a way that they all had to eat and kill one another, including those that eat and kill us or are eaten and killed by us? Why in your eyes is “war” correct, and do you believe your all-powerful God was incapable of designing a peaceful “garden of Eden”?

DAVID: I haven't tried to conceive of a different peaceful form of life. Is it even possible? You raised the issue, so let's have your version.

I gave it to you in the previous post: a garden of Eden, in which all living forms cooperate peacefully with one another and get their food from sources that do not have to be hunted and killed. You have given us a fine example:

Bacteria help ground squirrels hibernate

QUOTE: "Sommer, who in 2016 reported the presence of seasonal bacteria potentially beneficial to hibernating brown bears, says that these new findings show that “there is an interplay” between the host and its intestinal microbiota “that allows specific adaptations” to hibernation." (David's bold)

DAVID: As noted previously, here is another example of the importance of bacteria, who are at the war on each other, that dhw needlessly worries about. Bacteria contribute to so many aspects of comfortable living, it would take a book to describe all of their contributions. Life started with bacteria and we can't live without them. Note the bolds.

Why did you insert “who are at war on each other”? You have just shown precisely how your all-powerful God could have created peaceful, cooperative life without war if he had wanted to. Please tell us why you think he chose not to.