Return to David's theory of evolution PART 2 (Evolution)

by dhw, Friday, May 27, 2022, 08:31 (909 days ago) @ David Turell

dhw: On the question of why he designed countless life forms and foods that had no connection with humans and our food: “God makes sense only to himself.”

DAVID: See the other thread for the logical answer. Food supply is required NOW for 7.8 billion folks with many malnourished. The bush could work better but must work.

Correct. Nothing to do with the previous 3.X thousand million years’ worth of food supplies.

DAVID: And God making sense to Himself is a truism, and contains an answer that tells you God must know what He is doing. It worked and we are here discussing Him. I cannot unfold His thinking to unfold all your doubts.

Of course God makes sense to himself, but you keep forgetting that according to you, your theory ONLY makes sense to him, i.e. not to you. My own theories make perfect sense to you (see Part One). My doubts concern YOUR thinking, not his (which we can only theorize about).

DAVID: My analysis may not reflect the designer's reasons. but they are the best guesses I have. You simply object to the known record He created. I find your objections totally illogical.

You continue to pretend that I object to the “known record”. I do not. The known record is the history of countless life forms and econiches that came and went – the latest of these being humans and our econiches. I challenge your belief that every single extinct life form and econiche was specially designed as an “absolute requirement” for us and our econiches, but you continue to pretend that your inexplicable belief is part of the history.

DAVID: You have objected to the roundabout way humans arrived since we started these discussions. You don't like the 'God's choice' answer, but it is one sensible point. It is a roundabout way but the way that happened. You simply object to God's choice of method, so you know better than God how to do it. I don't.

I have no objections whatsoever to the roundabout way in which H. sapiens arrived. I have no objections whatsoever to the history of life as we know it. I only object to your assumption that your God’s one and only purpose was to design us and therefore he designed countless life forms etc. that had no connection with us, and he chose to design us in stages although he was perfectly capable of designing species de novo, with no precursors. I have offered logical explanations to explain all these anomalies, but you stick to a theory which “makes sense only to God” and so clearly does not make sense to you.

Second article:

DAVID: Only a rigid blind faith in chance could believe in the current results of evolution as coming from chance.

dhw: Agreed. And we don’t need masses of jargon to make that point. Nor should we ignore the fact that a rigid blind faith is also required for belief in the existence of an unknown, hidden, all-powerful, sourceless mind, capable of creating a universe and all the intricacies of living cells, and which has simply been there for ever and ever.

DAVID: Again avoiding the point, complex biochemical life must have a designer mind creating its not blind faith, but logical reasoning to jump the chasm, that I finally took.

Yes, the design argument is a logical reason for “jumping the chasm”, which entails blind faith in the existence of an “an unknown, hidden all-powerful, sourceless mind” etc., as bolded above.

Dragonflies

DAVID: How did this organism evolve with such intricate flight controls for a strange elongated body shape. Only design fits. And to prepare for the usual dhw complaint, dragonflies have many important functions in their ecosystem.

I agree that design fits. If God exists, it is possible that he endowed the cells of which all life forms are made with the intelligence to design their own means of survival. All life forms have important functions in their ecosystem. This does not mean that all life forms and econiches over the last 3.x billion years, including dragonflies, were “an absolute requirement for the evolutionary process [by which you mean God’s individual design of every life form and econiche] to finally produce humans”.