Return to David's theory of evolution (Evolution)

by David Turell , Tuesday, August 23, 2022, 15:58 (612 days ago) @ dhw

DAVID: And my answer always is God chose to evolve us from bacteria (Archaea) at the start of life.

dhw: We agree that humans evolved from bacteria!!! But you insist that your God also individually designed all those past life forms and econiches that did NOT lead to us and our food, which makes nonsense of your claim that we and our food were his one and only purpose. Please, please, stop dodging!

Our difference is about food supply. I view the entire bush of life as vital to feed us in this huge population we've grown into.

DAVID: As an outsider to belief, try to understand God by assuming everything that happens is under His direct control for His reasons.

dhw: Please stop pretending that my criticisms of your illogical theories, and the logical alternatives I offer, are invalid because I am an agnostic. You do not have any more knowledge of the “truth” than I do. Of course if he exists he has his reasons for doing what he has done. Your theories make no sense to you. You agree that my alternatives are logical and make sense to you, but you reject them because they endow him with different human attributes than those you incorporate into your own theories.

Once again, stop accusing me of nonsense. My theories are perfectly logical to me, if not to you, as your now bolded statement shows.

DAVID: Exactly the point!!! God is not in the business of creating organisms primarily for His enjoyment, or interest, or entertainment. These are secondary after events that may or may not occur. God purposely creates what He wishes is all we can know.

dhw: We agree 100% that if he exists, he purposely creates what he wishes. If you are sure he "enjoys" and is "interested", you have no reason to dismiss the idea that he might primarily “wish” to create things he will enjoy and be interested in! (That includes us.)

God does not need self-gratifying results of His creations.

dhw: I keep pointing out all the possible “human” attributes you ascribe to your God […]

DAVID: Of course, God has some human like attributes but they don't drive His purposes.

dhw: How can you possibly know that?

DAVID: We can only observe what God does, anything more is pure conjecture, and we've done plenty of that.

dhw: Correct. So please stop assuming that your illogical conjectures must be true and none of my logical alternatives can possibly be true because you are a believer and I am an agnostic.

If you assume my theories make no sense to me, I can assume your theories are the results of false assumptions about God, especially His personality.

Cellular intelligence

DAVID: God's so-called intelligent cells are simply following His provided instructions.

dhw: That is your theory, and other scientists believe that cells have an autonomous intelligence of their own, but of course that does not exclude the possibility that your God designed their autonomous intelligence, just as you believe he designed our own.

DAVID: Yes, God as the designer is my constant theme.

dhw: I have no objections to the logical assumption that if God exists, he is the designer. We simpler differ on what he might have designed and why he might have designed it.

True.