David's theory of evolution: God's error corrections II (Evolution)

by dhw, Wednesday, October 28, 2020, 08:32 (1485 days ago) @ David Turell

DAVID: Note the reference to informative instructions in my bold in the first paragraph. Only a designer could supply them.

dhw: You persistently miss the point that once a new system works, it will repeat itself indefinitely. That is how organs remain organs, and species remain species! You say each one was designed by your God, and I propose cellular intelligence as the originator.

dhw: I’m pleased to see that you have no objections to this important point, as you very frequently confine your focus to the automatic activities of established systems as if they also explained the origin of those systems.

DAVID: My point is God designs new systems from existing ones. That is evolution.

You had used automatic cellular behaviour as evidence that only a designer (your God) could provide the necessary instructions. My point is that the same instructions would have been passed on by intelligent cells if they were the designers of the new system. And intelligent cells designing new systems from existing ones is also evolution. (But the original intelligent cells may have been designed by your God.)

dhw: Bearing in mind that there is “no direct connection” between the brontosaurus and humans, econiches supply food only for the organisms alive at the time, “extinct life plays no role in current time”, and your belief that your God directly designed every species, what part did the brontosaurus play in the direct design of humans? If the answer is “none”, we can at last move on.

DAVID: The only role is as an ancestor as evolution run by God developed newer forms of complexity

dhw: “Ancestor” implies a direct line – as from apes to humans. In the context of our discussion, you are now telling us that every extinct and in many case extant organism that ever lived was directly designed by your God as our ancestor. You look at apes in the zoo and recognize them as your ancestors. Do you honestly look at your dog and horses which, like the brontosaurus, were here long before us, and recognize them as your ancestors? I’m sorry, but the idea that your God directly designed the brontosaurus and every other organism in history because he needed to do so in order to directly design humans (“as part of the goal of evolving humans”) seems to me to be verging on the ridiculous.

DAVID: We evolved from the past organisms and of course from the early primate groups. That group is our direct ancestors, but we go way back to bacteria! I view evolution of all branches part of God's design of evolution, and He decided what He needed to do.

Your reply blatantly avoids the question of how ALL branches of evolution could be “part of the goal of evolving [= directly designing] humans” ALL branches of the bush go back to bacteria, but that does not make the brontosaurus or your dog or your horses our ancestors.

DAVID: The huge bush is energy supply for our giant population. Why do I have to keep repeating the obvious logic?

The huge bushes of the past do not supply one drop of energy for our giant population of the present:“extinct life plays no role in current time”. Why do you keep repeating arguments which you yourself have demolished? I really think we should close this thread, as your avoidance of the issue can only leave us running around in the same circles.

See “Balance of nature: ecosystems are losing diversity” for a truly scurrilous distortion of this whole argument.