Back to David's theory of evolution (Evolution)

by David Turell , Friday, August 28, 2020, 22:35 (1546 days ago) @ dhw

DAVID: We go 'round and 'round. I'll stick with God chose to evolve us, and the bush has everything to do with us as a support of us. You dodge my answer as unacceptable to you.

dhw: I do not dodge it. I ask you over and over again how 3.X billion years’ worth of specially designed bushes (econiches) could support us when we hadn’t yet arrived on the scene. Do please answer.

My answer is what you refuse to accept: God evolved us from all that bush of life over 3.8 by. Obviously we are supported by the arrival of everything in this last stage

DAVID: Every part of the giant bush of life can be shown to have a purpose, from a purposeful God, whom you do not understand the way I do.

dhw: …of course every part of the giant bush of life can be shown to have a purpose, but that does not mean that the purpose was to evolve humans! You keep coming up with general truths and glossing over the fact that it is the COMBINATION of your beliefs bolded above that leaves you with “no idea” why your God chose to “evolve” (= specially design) H. sapiens by first “evolving (= specially designing) all the other branches of the giant bush.

DAVID: We have different beliefs. The gaps will not change.

dhw: I offer a variety of possible theistic interpretations of life’s history. They are not beliefs, but you always agree that they are logical. Only you have a fixed belief in a particular combination of what you call “guesses”, and it is the only combination that neither of us can explain logically.

Again, all logical to me. God creates all of reality, and history tells us how. You want the 'why' of His choice of method, and logically there is no firm answer, just guesses, about which both of us has given opinions..

Under “Balance of nature: importance of ecosystems underground"
https://www.sciencemag.org/news/2020/08/hidden-webs-fungi-protect-some-forests-drought-...

QUOTE: "The future of the world’s flora may depend as much, if not more, on what’s below the ground as what’s above. Beneath 90% of all plants lies an invisible support system—subterranean fungal partners that form a network of filaments connecting plants and bringing nutrients and water to their roots. In return, the plants provide a steady supply of carbon to the fungi. Now, researchers are learning that these hidden partners can shape how ecosystems respond to climate change."

DAVID: A different kind of ecosystem. Large parts of the bush of life are really interconnected webs of support. All necessary to support the massive populations now living in the confines of Earth. God's planning dhw doesn't recognize.

dhw: Thank you for another fascinating article, but what a shame you have to spoil these posts with such silly remarks. Of course I recognize that econiches are “interconnected webs of support”. What I do not recognize is (a) that every econiche in life’s history was specially designed as “part of God’s plan to evolve humans”, and (b) even if God exists, that he personally preprogrammed or dabbled every single interconnection in every single econiche for the last 3.8 billion years.

You comment is to the point you do not believe in God, and certainly do not view His works as I do.

DAVID: (under “Top predator reversal”): Weird. Normally a top predator continues to dominate. not if the local environment changes along shorelines:
https://phys.org/news/2020-08-sticklebacks-dominate-perch.html

DAVID: All caused by brackish water and the addition of unwanted extra minerals (eutrophication). All ecosystems are in delicate balance and the sum total of them is the bush of life.

dhw: Thank you for this article too, and for a much more balanced conclusion. Just to clarify, though: these two articles refer to the current bush of life. Whether your God exists, and whether he planned every single econiche in the 3.8-billion-year-old history of life, including the current one, and why he would plan every single econiche in life’s history as “part of the goal of evolving humans” all remain open to question.

All remain open to your question. I'm satisfied in my position.