Back to David's theory of evolution (Evolution)

by David Turell @, Monday, July 13, 2020, 17:41 (382 days ago) @ dhw

DAVID: I'm convinced God arranges for instincts. As for my observation as to how animals learn, I know what happens with horses. Why object. I don't remember any examples resembling the problem bees present: leaves are not flowers, and the bitten leaves happen weeks before flowers appear. Their earlier appearance is another part of the conceptual observation .

dhw: There are many things you are convinced about, but I’m afraid your conviction alone does not make for rational argument. I gave you examples of how insects and animals make provision for the future as a result of their observations and experiences, ranging from food storage and hibernation to migration and parasitic and symbiotic relationships: they all entail observation over time resulting in what will eventually become what you call “instinct”.

Correlating two completely separate events in time requires abstract thought in the analysis of the events. Your mind sees the obvious correlation, so you think the bees can also. Totally illogical. I'll produce an entry later to answer you. (See Egnor)

DAVID: That is the point of Behe's new book! Why couldn't God program it all in the beginning?

dhw: Fancy your God having to step in and disconnect billions of programmes every time he wants to start one. Or do you think the leaf-biting bee disconnects the other billions of programmes all by herself? Or has God provided her and every other organism in the history of life with a programme for automatically disconnecting the other billions of programmes?

DAVID: I'm delighted you are confused about Behe. He has disturbed lots of Darwinist folks. The bold is a misinterpretation. Destroying some DNA allows a new advance to appear. Really simple, and means the underlying evolutionary information is all there waiting to be let out.

dhw: So instead of disconnecting programmes, you have your God destroying one layer of programmes, and then up pops…what? The single programme for leaf-biting bees. All the other umpteen billions of programmes simply disappear.

DAVID: There is an easily seen reason for this: think of packing for a long trip, which requires much thinking and planning. On the trip unpacking is easy as a result of foresight. Seen in patterns of planning.

dhw: You asked why your God “couldn’t program it all in the beginning”. I would suggest that your image of unpacking is woefully out of kilter. According to you, the suitcase is already packed with every single life form, lifestyle, natural wonder etc. in the history of life. And so when your God wants only to produce a leaf biting bee, he chucks out every other item in the suitcase.

Woefully misinterpreted. In my an analogy I imagine unpacking one article at a time as I put them in the closet or drawer in my motel room.

DAVID: The bird skeleton and ours may differ but everything is actually comparable. Think of courses in comparative anatomy offered in biology.

dhw: Yes indeed – this is regarded as evidence for evolution and common descent. What has that got to do with your God’s special programme for leaf-biting bees?

Not related to my attempt to clear up your misguided thinking.

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