David's theory of evolution: God's error corrections II (Evolution)

by David Turell , Wednesday, September 30, 2020, 16:08 (1513 days ago) @ dhw

dhw: Who designed the parasite? But it is ONLY a failure if, as you have stated, your God doesn’t wish us any harm. Of course the nasty viruses, bacteria, parasites and “errors” in God’s specially designed system of life are part of the bush of life. And theodicy is what we are discussing here. Your solution appears to be that I should stop thinking about the bad bits (“back to the donut and its hole”) and focus on the good bits. I’m suggesting as you did that a Garden of Eden would be dull, and that the mixture of good and bad is precisely what your God wanted, and he achieved what he wanted by giving cells the freedom to do their own designing.

DAVID: I agree about the Garden of Eden but not the cells as you want them to be.

dhw: Then we are back to the question of why a God who wishes us no harm directly designed the harmful viruses, bacteria and parasites.

Maybe they are necessary in a way we do not understand, just as we don't understand quantum mechanics, but it works. There is no other answer

DAVID: Harmful viruses and bacteria keep life a challenge, and we have been given the brains to fight them.

dhw: Bad luck on all the other creatures they killed before we came along. And bad luck on all the humans who are still dying in their millions. (I see your God’s coronavirus has now achieved a million deaths, not to mention the umpteen million folk who may be affected for the rest of their lives.) But it’s OK, because presumably God – who wishes us no harm – wants to challenge us. NB it is YOUR theory that he designed them – not mine.

Tell me who designed the bad viruses and bacteria. What is your source?

dhw: As far as evolution is concerned, do you or do you not accept that adaptation goes ahead without your God’s intervention? If so, do you or do you not accept that (theistic version) your God must have created a mechanism enabling cells to change their structure in accordance with the demands of the environment?

DAVID: God has allowed living organisms to adapt. We all know that.

dhw: That is not what I am asking! Please answer the questions - especially the second.

DAVID: Obviously, there are structural changes that are not speciation as part of adaptability.

dhw: Yes, obviously. So do you agree that he must have created a mechanism enabling cells to change their structure without his intervention in accordance with the demands of the environment?

Those structural changes are never speciation, just necessary adaptations. You want to find a mechanism that stretches that degree of change. It isn't there currently that we can find.

dhw: Here’s a simple choice for you, based on two of your premises. QUESTION: Why did God design every life form, econiche, natural wonder etc. that ever existed? ANSWER 1: Because the only life forms he wanted to design were H. sapiens plus food supply. ANSWER 2: Because he wanted to design them all. Which of these would you say makes more sense?

DAVID: If God chose to evolve us of course He desired to create all the necessary stages as a part of the process. Answer one is your unreasonable version of my theory. We were His purposeful eventual outcome.

dhw: You have stated categorically that all life forms were “part of the goal of evolving humans”. That means his goal was to “evolve” (which according to you means directly design) humans. Your answer confirms your belief that every single life form, econiche, natural wonder etc. that ever existed over the last 3.8 thousand million years was directly designed as a “necessary stage” for him to be able to directly design every stage from early hominins and homos to H. sapiens plus food supply. No wonder you lay such emphasis on the fact that we cannot know God’s way of reasoning!

It is patently obvious God wanted to create us. Those reasons can only be guessed at. Where is your emphasis? To guess at them?