Back to David's theory of evolution (Evolution)

by David Turell , Tuesday, August 04, 2020, 19:26 (1570 days ago) @ dhw

DAVID: Please see today's error entry to clarify your thinking.

dhw: Your thinking remains as contradictory as ever.

The confusion is yours

DAVID: Shapiro theory of no value.

dhw: If your God did not design every species but “allowed” the relevant random mutations to happen, then random mutations led to speciation (Darwin). Shapiro suggests the mutations were the product of cellular intelligence. So you are now a Darwinian.

Not at all. See the errors thread for hopeful clarity for you.

DAVID: (under “Brain expansion”): […] You've pounced on errors as a gift from me to denigrate God. But it hasn't worked.

dhw: This is not denigration of God! You wrote: “I am the one willing to show that God is not all-powerful and all knowing and He can’t stop molecular errors in a system he created.” THAT is denigration of your God. I propose that he did what he WANTED to do – namely, create a mechanism that would give rise to the higgledy-piggledy bush of life’s history, culminating (so far) in humans. No denigration. You have simply proposed a theory of errors which negates your theory of speciation by your God's direct design.

God was always under full control as I've described. You want a weak humanized God who allows mistakes to make advances. Not my view of a highly purposeful God in any way.

xxxx

Under “Nature’s Wonders”:

dhw: The “whole vast bush of life” reaches back 3.8 billion years, 99% of it being extinct. Of course creatures within any econiche are connected, but it is patently absurd to claim that turtles…show that every single econiche in the history of life “had to be built as part of the goal of creating humans”. [...]

DAVID: Thank you for finally recognizing the interconnection of econiches and then presenting your usual confused and limited understanding of their importance.

I have always recognized the interconnectedness of econiches, have never underestimated their importance for ALL organisms extant and extinct (i.e. the ones you prefer to forget about), but have always challenged your repeated assumption that every econiche in the history of life was directly designed by your God “as part of the goal of creating humans”. Please stop erecting silly straw men.

Always a logical rejoinder analyzing how God handled His process of evolving us from bacteria.

DAVID: Your capacity for not following my logic is endless. God runs reality and history therefore tells us what He did, but not why.

dhw: But you keep telling us why: “as part of the goal of creating humans”. And you keep agreeing that you can’t explain how every single econiche in history contributed towards the direct design of H. sapiens. If you can’t explain something , please don’t tell us it is logical.

Same silly distortion. I don 't try to explain His choice of method.

Your comments on two more fascinating natural wonders:

DAVID: An insect cannot develop a toxin by trial and error and survive. Designed by God.

dhw: Maybe its ancestors survived by other means.

Tell me the other means, can you?

DAVID: Bacteria were the start of evolution, and are still here contributing to the balance of nature in so many ways we have demonstrated here. No wonder they were kept around as the longest lasting organisms. I'm sure by God's design.

dhw: I agree with most of this! Bacteria are integral to all forms of life, including our own (we apparently have about 39 trillion of them, along with 30 trillion cells). Our bodies are communities of cells and bacteria that cooperate to keep us going, and some scientists say that they do so with their autonomous intelligence. I would add that if so, this intelligence may be “by God’s design”.

I'm sure it's by God's design to have cells follow His intelligent instructions