David's theory of evolution: God's error corrections II (Evolution)

by dhw, Tuesday, October 27, 2020, 09:06 (1486 days ago) @ David Turell

QUOTE: "BB The embryo begins to make its placenta without direct guidance from its mother — rather, it follows a set of molecularly encoded, do-it-yourself assembly instructions. (David’s bold)

DAVID: Note the reference to informative instructions in my bold in the first paragraph. Only a designer could supply them.

dhw: You persistently miss the point that once a new system works, it will repeat itself indefinitely. That is how organs remain organs, and species remain species! You say each one was designed by your God, and I propose cellular intelligence as the originator.

I’m pleased to see that you have no objections to this important point, as you very frequently confine your focus to the automatic activities of established systems as if they also explained the origin of those systems.

dhw: This is also the difference between my proposal (plus Shapiro's and Talbott's) and yours.

DAVID: Talbott doesn't Know how the cells developed intelligence. Shapiro uses bacteria which can edit DNA as examples, nothing more.

Nobody “knows” how life and evolution began or developed. Both Talbott and Shapiro believe in cellular intelligence. You don’t. That is the difference between you and them.

DAVID:Again forgetting my reasonable theory about ecosystems offering food supply for all, in all the branches of the bush not just humans in their branch

dhw: That is indeed the reasonable theory I have been trying to put across! Every extinct ecosystem offered food to its OWN forms and not in any way, shape or form, to humans! So how could they ALL have been part of the goal of evolving (= designing) humans???

DAVID: We both accept common descent!!! As shown by related DNA and specific genes, some of which have different functions in different species at differing levels evolution.

The bold focuses on ecosystems, and you have at last recognized that past and extinct ecosystems have nothing whatsoever to do with present ecosystems (“extinct life plays no role in current time”), and therefore played no part in “the goal of evolving [= directly designing] humans.” Yes, we accept common descent, but millions of non-human organisms branched out in different directions, leading to millions of different species which became extinct and which had no direct connection to humans. You believe they were all separately designed by your God. Hence the question I asked you:

dhw: Bearing in mind that there is “no direct connection” between the brontosaurus and humans, econiches supply food only for the organisms alive at the time, “extinct life plays no role in current time”, and your belief that your God directly designed every species, what part did the brontosaurus play in the direct design of humans? If the answer is “none”, we can at last move on.

DAVID: The only role is as an ancestor as evolution run by God developed newer forms of complexity

“Ancestor” implies a direct line – as from apes to humans. In the context of our discussion, you are now telling us that every extinct and in many case extant organism that ever lived was directly designed by your God as our ancestor. You look at apes in the zoo and recognize them as your ancestors. Do you honestly look at your dog and horses which, like the brontosaurus, were here long before us, and recognize them as your ancestors? I’m sorry, but the idea that your God directly designed the brontosaurus and every other organism in history because he needed to do so in order to directly design humans (“as part of the goal of evolving humans”) seems to me to be verging on the ridiculous.