Back to David's theory of evolution (Evolution)

by dhw, Friday, August 28, 2020, 10:18 (33 days ago) @ David Turell

DAVID: Your problem is I don't try to identify a reason for God choosing to want us to evolve. There is no logical reason to do that, as it is all guess work, except Adler's cogent argument using our specialness, which still only implies God's definite purpose, not reasons. My theory definitely holds all its part together with the simple statement 'God chose to evolve us'.

dhw: By “evolve” you mean specially design, because you always emphasize that every species and every human advance had to be preprogrammed or directly dabbled. Our specialness is not the issue. The issue, for the umpteenth time, is why bban all-powerful, all-controlling God who directly designs all species, and whose ONLY purpose is to design us (and our food supply), would directly design millions of now extinct non-human life forms, econiches, lifestyles, strategies, natural wonders etc. that have nothing to do with humans.bb You know this is the issue, you have no answer to the question, and so you continue to dodge it.

DAVID: We go 'round and 'round. I'll stick with God chose to evolve us, and the bush has everything to do with us as a support of us. You dodge my answer as unacceptable to you.

I do not dodge it. I ask you over and over again how 3.X billion years’ worth of specially designed bushes (econiches) could support us when we hadn’t yet arrived on the scene. Do please answer.

DAVID: Same statement of your confusion about my logical thoughts. My God created evolution, in a manor clearly stated many times in the past by designing all species. Thus it appears like the evolution Darwin thought naturally evolved.

dhw: This belief would not be a problem in itself. It only becomes a problem when you combine it with the other beliefs I have listed above in bold. Stop dodging!

DAVID: Expect no change. No dodge except in your distorted view.

Then please answer the question posed above.

DAVID: Every part of the giant bush of life can be shown to have a purpose, from a purposeful God, whom you do not understand the way I do.

dhw: …of course every part of the giant bush of life can be shown to have a purpose, but that does not mean that the purpose was to evolve humans! You keep coming up with general truths and glossing over the fact that it is the COMBINATION of your beliefs bolded above that leaves you with “no idea” why your God chose to “evolve” (= specially design) H. sapiens by first “evolving (= specially designing) all the other branches of the giant bush.

DAVID: We have different beliefs. The gaps will not change.

I offer a variety of possible theistic interpretations of life’s history. They are not beliefs, but you always agree that they are logical. Only you have a fixed belief in a particular combination of what you call “guesses”, and it is the only combination that neither of us can explain logically.

Under “Balance of nature: importance of ecosystems underground"
https://www.sciencemag.org/news/2020/08/hidden-webs-fungi-protect-some-forests-drought-...

QUOTE: "The future of the world’s flora may depend as much, if not more, on what’s below the ground as what’s above. Beneath 90% of all plants lies an invisible support system—subterranean fungal partners that form a network of filaments connecting plants and bringing nutrients and water to their roots. In return, the plants provide a steady supply of carbon to the fungi. Now, researchers are learning that these hidden partners can shape how ecosystems respond to climate change."

DAVID: A different kind of ecosystem. Large parts of the bush of life are really interconnected webs of support. All necessary to support the massive populations now living in the confines of Earth. God's planning dhw doesn't recognize.

Thank you for another fascinating article, but what a shame you have to spoil these posts with such silly remarks. Of course I recognize that econiches are “interconnected webs of support”. What I do not recognize is (a) that every econiche in life’s history was specially designed as “part of God’s plan to evolve humans”, and (b) even if God exists, that he personally preprogrammed or dabbled every single interconnection in every single econiche for the last 3.8 billion years.

DAVID: (under “Top predator reversal”): Weird. Normally a top predator continues to dominate. not if the local environment changes along shorelines:
https://phys.org/news/2020-08-sticklebacks-dominate-perch.html

DAVID: All caused by brackish water and the addition of unwanted extra minerals (eutrophication). All ecosystems are in delicate balance and the sum total of them is the bush of life.

Thank you for this article too, and for a much more balanced conclusion. Just to clarify, though: these two articles refer to the current bush of life. Whether your God exists, and whether he planned every single econiche in the 3.8-billion-year-old history of life, including the current one, and why he would plan every single econiche in life’s history as “part of the goal of evolving humans” all remain open to question.


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