Let's study ID: giraffe plumbing: cognition (Introduction)

by David Turell @, Sunday, November 07, 2021, 14:45 (20 days ago) @ dhw

DAVID: Don't you understand the other forms are the food! That is the connection. The huge human population requires the huge bush of life organized into ecosystems.

dhw: “Don’t you understand” that for thousands of millions of years, you claim that your God designed life forms and foods and ecosystems that had no connection with humans? And yet you claim that all of them were part of his goal of designing us humans and our food! That is illogical!

Not illogical when evolution is understood to be stepwise development of more complex body forms.


DAVID: I don't need the missing logic you seek. God does what He wants for His reasons and I accept that.

dhw: Once more: you are theorizing that he did what YOU want him to have done – namely, make humans his one and only purpose. That does not fit in with your belief that he is all-powerful, can create new species without precursors, and yet spent 3.X billion years designing countless life forms and food and econiches that had no connection with humans. You know all this, you have acknowledged that it doesn’t make sense to you, and yet you still go on “accepting” your own theory that God wanted what you want him to have wanted! (But NB I have also provided logical explanations of the bush if your God really did specially want to design us.)

You forget I'm with Adler. Our specialness makes us a prime purpose for God who chose to evolve us from bacteria as history shows. The God I believe in creates the history we study. I find your objection totally illogical.


Fungus controls male flies
DAVID: God speciates and produced us from the start of life in bacteria, producing new forms stepwise until we appeared.

dhw: How can you say he produced us from the start of life if he only started the process of producing us when you say he produced the new Cambrian species that had no precursors? And why do you keep omitting your belief that he also produced all the other life forms that had no connection with us, although we were his only goal?

DAVID: The issue of form precursors is your weird new straw man. Darwin and I know the Cambrian gap is a body form gap. Why don't you.

dhw: I had to remind you that evolution was related to body form!!! You wrote (see the beginning of this post): “We're descended from bacteria because we use the same biochemical processes that produce life.” You were trying to gloss over the contradiction between your belief that we are descended from bacteria, and your belief that we are not, because we are descended from new species designed “without precursors” during the Cambrian.

You have finally understood my designer God makes new species in completely new forms (phenotypes) without precursor forms

dhw: I replied:
"You have just agreed with three exclamation marks that evolution entails changes of form, not of biochemical processes, and God creates new species (i.e. forms) without precursors, and you tell us that we are descended from just such new forms."
Then I proposed that the body form gap might be explained by absence of fossils and/or cellular intelligence capable of designing major as well as minor innovations. And you still haven’t answered either of my questions at the start of this section.

Absence of fossils for 170 years since Darwin resulting in the gap unchanged or larger is becoming a faint hope. Why do you cling to it? As for cells bright enough to jump the gap, the theory is extrapolating the the appearance that single cells do act as if intelligent. That intelligence is confined to their simple responses to stimuli producing standard results.


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