Let's study ID: giraffe plumbing (Introduction)

by dhw, Tuesday, October 19, 2021, 11:04 (46 days ago) @ David Turell

DAVID: Splitting our reality into separate parts doesn't work. From the Big Bang on it is one continuous evolutionary process.

dhw: Apart from when you have your God creating new life forms with no precursors. Once more: you have your God continuously producing countless forms of life and food, all of which were apparently part of his goal of evolving humans and our foods, but the majority of which had no connection with humans and our foods. No connection = separate parts. Stop dodging.

DAVID: The connection is the giant food supply for all. Life needs a constant input of energy. Accept it and stop your dodge of ignoring it.

Nobody in his right mind would disagree that all life forms need energy. The disagreement is over your insistence that all life forms and all foods were part of your God’s one and only goal of designing humans and our food, although the vast majority had no evolutionary connection with humans. You don’t even have all of them descending from bacteria now, as you once claimed, since you insist that we are descended from life forms that had no precursors.

dhw: It is you who insist that we were his one and only goal. That is the problem. Whenever you try to squirm out of it by talking of plural goals, I ask you what they might have been. You have said you are sure your God enjoys creating, and watches his creations with interest, but the moment I propose that this might mean his goal was enjoyment and having interesting things to watch, you dismiss the idea, and scurry back to “humanization”, trying desperately to forget that you have agreed that your God probably/possibly has thought patterns like ours, and we “mimic” him, and “his logic is like ours” (although now apparently he “doesn’t have to be logical”).

DAVID: My opinions about God's intentions are all guesses. Neither of us knows Him better than the other, but I avoid your humanizing approach.

Everyone’s opinions are guesses, but it absurd to dismiss guesses that are actually based on your own, and the “humanizing” moan also runs contrary to your own guesses, as above. You have long since demolished your own food and humanizing arguments, so please stop contradicting yourself.

dhw: […] what is “weak” about enjoying creation, experimenting, getting new ideas, deliberately creating an ever changing spectacle? Why are these activities more “humanized” than your version of a God who creates a system he can’t control, though he tried – often in vain – to correct the errors in his design?

DAVID: My God doesn't wander around like your clueless version. "Far from in full control" doesn't understand how living biochemistry works almost flawlessly. For you the problem is errors stand out as total objections to God existing.

Your usual scurrilous attempt to defend your illogicality by pretending that my theistic explanations are somehow meant to deny the existence of God. And there is nothing “clueless” or “namby-pamby” or “weak” about the God described in my comment above. See “theodicy” concerning your gross misrepresentation of errors in relation to that subject.

Immunity system complexity
DAVID: That cognizance is automatic is what I was taught.[…]

dhw: […] If you don’t know the meaning of the words you use, then please don’t blame me. You will never ever find any dictionary that defines “cognizance” as being in any way automatic. It entails conscious understanding.

DAVID: And it comes from the same source as recognize, which is a term we use in biology/medicine that cells can automatically recognize non-self as a built in ability.

A built-in ability is what facilitates the awareness that underlies recognition and invention. The built-in ability is what we might call conscious intelligence, which enables life forms to recognize things inside and outside themselves and to take decisions on how to deal with them. Please stop inserting the word “automatically” as if somehow biologists and medics had all discovered the source of the cell’s ability to recognize, adjust, make decisions etc.

DAVID: I follow my teaching, God not discussed in med school

Precisely. Your teachers did not identify your God as the unknown source, so please stop pretending that they all knew the source of the ability.


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