Let's study ID: giraffe plumbing (Introduction)

by dhw, Wednesday, October 20, 2021, 09:30 (38 days ago) @ David Turell

DAVID: The connection is the giant food supply for all. Life needs a constant input of energy. Accept it and stop your dodge of ignoring it.

dhw: Nobody in his right mind would disagree that all life forms need energy. The disagreement is over your insistence that all past life forms and all foods were part of your God’s one and only goal of designing humans and our food, although the vast majority had no evolutionary connection with humans. You don’t even have all of them descending from bacteria now, as you once claimed, since you insist that we are descended from life forms that had no precursors.

DAVID: There is a line of evolution to humans, and many branches for necessary food, that you agree we all need. The Cambrian shows no direct precursors, but a giant leap in forms and functions. Have you abandoned poor Darwin who complained about the gap in form?

It is you have abandoned poor Darwin and your own belief that your God “evolved” humans from bacteria. You insist that we are descended from life forms without precursors. So for 3.X billion years your God hadn’t even started to fulfil his one and only purpose. As for food, how long will you to continue to ignore your own demolition of the argument that your God could not have designed humans plus food without first designing life forms plus food that had no connection with humans? Yet again I quote you: “The current bush of food is NOW for humans NOW. There were smaller bushes in the PAST for PAST forms” and “Extinct life has no role in current time.

dhw: […] what is “weak” about enjoying creation, experimenting, getting new ideas, deliberately creating an ever changing spectacle? Why are these activities more “humanized” than your version of a God who creates a system he can’t control, though he tried – often in vain – to correct the errors in his design?

DAVID: My God doesn't wander around like your clueless version. "Far from in full control" doesn't understand how living biochemistry works almost flawlessly. For you the problem is errors stand out as total objections to God existing.

dhw: Your usual scurrilous attempt to defend your illogicality by pretending that my theistic explanations are somehow meant to deny the existence of God. And there is nothing “clueless” or “namby-pamby” or “weak” about the God described in my comment above.

DAVID: It doesn't fit the all powerful God described yesterday :" "For both Jews and Christians, here is the situation: We believe in an omnipotent, infinite God, and modern astronomical discoveries have confirmed that we inhabit a majestic universe befitting just such a creator. The psalmist got it right 3,000 years ago: “The heavens declare the glory of God” (Psalm 19:1)." (David's bold)

C.S.Lewis thought that somehow the vastness of the universe proved that God existed, which of course it doesn’t. But whether God exists or not, I too am in awe of the majestic universe and the miracles of life. And if God made life a free-for-all, or he experimented to fulfil a particular purpose, or he experimented to give himself new ideas, I am still in awe, and I have no idea why you think that such a God is clueless, weak or namby-pamby.

Immunity system complexity
DAVID: That cognizance is automatic is what I was taught.[…]

dhw: […] If you don’t know the meaning of the words you use, then please don’t blame me. You will never ever find any dictionary that defines “cognizance” as being in any way automatic. It entails conscious understanding.

DAVID: And it comes from the same source as recognize, which is a term we use in biology/medicine that cells can automatically recognize non-self as a built in ability.

dhw: A built-in ability is what facilitates the awareness that underlies recognition and invention. The built-in ability is what we might call conscious intelligence, which enables life forms to recognize things inside and outside themselves and to take decisions on how to deal with them. Please stop inserting the word “automatically” as if somehow biologists and medics had all discovered the source of the cell’s ability to recognize, adjust, make decisions etc.

DAVID: We who believe we know biochemistry see the automaticity in the protein reactions. […] biochemical professors preach automaticity.

You post articles and then try to ignore what they say and even what you yourself say:
QUOTE: “The only limiting thing here is our understanding of how the RNA is controlled…
QUOTE: "Kinney aims to clarify these mysteries [...] how the spliceosome reads the RNA sequence and makes its cutting decisions."
QUOTE: “The way in which the human immune system manages to maintain this delicate balance in the intestine largely remains a mystery."
QUOTE: However, the mystery of the way in which IgA antibodies regulate the consensual coexistence in the intestine has remained unsolved.
DAVID TURELL: The information for the standard cell production of antibodies is in the genome, and as yet a mystery.
DAVID TURELL: How [chaperone molecules] know based on protein reaction is yet to be discovered.

It appears that you “who know biochemistry” still have a bit to learn about biochemistry. McClintock, Margulis, Shapiro, Albrecht-Buehler knew/know a bit about biochemistry, and they think cells are intelligent.

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