David's theory of evolution: Stephen Talbott's view III (Evolution)

by David Turell , Thursday, July 02, 2020, 18:38 (1603 days ago) @ dhw

dhw: Just like Darwin, Talbott is telling you that his theory does not exclude God! There is no wall – he remains open-minded. Walls are created by those who have fixed beliefs.

DAVID: All agreed. You and Talbott are twins. It still revolve about chance or design and both of you stay neutral on the choice. ID folks and I don't.

dhw: And so you continue to miss the point. It is not a question of chance v. design! It is a question of what drives evolution. From the theist’s point of view: did God directly create every life form, econiche, natural wonder etc. – as you claim – or did he create an autonomous mechanism to do its own designing? Chance doesn’t come into it. This is a theistic debate between creationism (direct design) and evolution (but not Darwin’s version, because intelligent design replaces random mutations) as your God’s method of achieving whatever may have been his purpose.

DAVID: I've missed nothing. You have neatly removed the issue of chance by putting evolutionary advancements totally into God's hands, whether He directly designs everything or puts in an auto-design in some or all of the new evolutionary advances. I'm happy that, at least, chance and Darwin's method of evolution are gone.

dhw: Just to be clear. I have not put evolutionary advancements totally into God’s hands. I have simply offered the theistic version of the theory. My “twin” and I (and Shapiro) are trying to understand how evolution works. They are scientists who have concluded from their observations and those of fellow scientists that cells are intelligent, and they have proposed that this intelligence is responsible for evolutionary advances. Darwin proposes random mutations; Turell proposes direct creation by his God. Talbott and Darwin (and I) leave open the question of how it all began, and leaving the subject open ALLOWS for God as the “first cause”.

Good summary of your position. Ider's and I propose there is a designer for all that happens, including the development of evolution, and the intelligent cells are the result of running under the control of intelligent information.

Under “immune complexity”:
QUOTE: However, immune functions are not restricted to these 'specialists,' and many more cell types are able to sense when they are infected and contribute to the immune response against pathogens.

dhw: Yet again I’m reminded of the ant colony. The cell communities of which all multicelluar organisms consist are constantly cooperating with one another to protect the body/colony as a whole.

Cells like individual ants follow onboard instructions to help the whole.