Free Will: Egnor shows neurological proof (Introduction)

by David Turell , Saturday, November 28, 2020, 19:56 (1241 days ago) @ dhw

DAVID: In schizophrenia the soul's proper thoughts are translated into psychotic thought. The sick brain cannot handle the soul's thoughts properly so they appear distorted.

dhw: We’re talking about seizures, and you have told us that after a seizure, no patient has ever told you about the “proper” thoughts he had while his brain was distorting them. The obvious conclusion is that the thoughts came from the brain. You don’t need a soul to think proper thoughts which the brain distorts into improper thoughts!

The brain works on electric circuits to produce the soul's thoughts. Seizures force electricity to surge through the brain in whole or in part. That electricity, under no controls produces no thoughts. Therefore the brain, on its own does not/cannot think. The soul produces its thought by managing electrical stimulations of the neuron networks. Schizophrenia is just an example of how the brain handles thoughts in a sickly way to show the soul's dependence on normality in the brain function. You seem confused to me about this soul/brain relationship.

dhw: This argument makes total nonsense of your concept of free will: “the soul can only think with the form of brain it has to work with”, so clever brain, clever thoughts; stupid brain, stupid thoughts; warped brain, warped thoughts. And these conditions don’t influence your decisions? You could hardly have a more devastating rebuttal of free will (we’ll leave dualism out of it for the time being)

Exactly!!! Your bolded phrase is correct!!! They limit your possibilities/range of thought. Sick brains force sick thinking. Limited brain caused limited thinking. The free will expression of thoughts will be sick and limited in a sick brain. Full and 'normal' free will requires a normal brain. Remember the person with a limited brain still has his own free will within the limits. No loss of free will theory.

DAVID: You are simply following your weird concept of the soul/brain arrangement. Each individual with a damaged/incompetent brain expresses his free will within those limits.

dhw: Yes, that is option 2. The incompetent brain is “you”, and “you” alone take your decisions with no constraints other than those of the situation AND YOUR OWN LIMITATIONS. Option 1 is that you cannot help having an incompetent brain – it is something you were born with, and it determines your decisions even if you don’t realize it – as is the case with innumerable other factors that have never been under your control (upbringing, disease, accidents, traumatic experiences imposed from outside yourself…)

Agreed as it fits my exposition of brain neurology of thought.

dhw: And I must now add that if your “soul” can only think with the form of brain it has to work with, then the brain will determine what you wish to be.

DAVID: See above. We all have limits. I'm not the genius Einstein was. As I've noted in the past the complexity of one's concepts depends on the complex ability of one's brain to allow their production. What you miss is all of us/souls can think with our brain to its limits. The quality of brain limits folks ambitions. I can't replicate Einstein. I can't write plays, but I have become freely what I wished within my limits. Limiting free will does not mean my will is not free within those limits. So I will agree with you in a limited way. We all have limits to our desires about our possible accomplishments in life.

dhw: You are agreeing with me in a total way. All this is option 2, as bolded above. And what you are missing is option 1. And our conclusion will depend on which of these approaches we adopt.

As I interpret both your options , both are valid and correct. You are forced to use the brain you are given or develop in illness or whatever circumstance alters its function. But free will is still exercised within the old or new limits that appear.