A Sense of Free Will: the consciousness quagmire (Introduction)

by romansh , Monday, August 31, 2015, 13:52 (3372 days ago) @ David Turell
edited by romansh, Monday, August 31, 2015, 14:01

? 'choices independent of environment' is confusing without explanation. Do you mean independent of the environment of the brain? 
The brain, within and without. 
 
> As for consciousness, I use mine to consider my choices to perform at my will. And yes it certainly has a sense of purposeful intentionality. I feel the two, free will and consciousness, are intimately related. 
So you say ... We are trying to establish the 'veracity' of our feelings not whether we have them or not.-> Are you implying there is no cause and effect relationship to my creation of free will decisions? I feel there is. 
No I am saying if there is a 'mechanism' for our free will then the concept of free will is either an oxymoron or that is has been redefined to something else.-> I wouldn't raise the issues of unconscious and subconscious activity. Freudian psychiatry is passing away. It makes much more sense to look at the sources of personality traits and defense mechanisms. These comes from the 'history' you referred to in another entry preceding this one. We all make our own personality and thought patterns leading to free will intentionality from teachings, past experiences and trial and error. 
And yet you continually dredge up consciousness as your prime exhibit for free will? -> As for the source of consciousness I don't know which laws of physics to suspend. If the brain is a receiver, laws of physics are active. If consciousness is due to quantum activity in the brain, laws still apply. The presence of the brain seems to be required except in the NDE episodes, where it appears a functional brain is not required. 
Even if consciousness actually exists in the form you seem to be proposing (something ethereal as far as I can make out) then that too will respond to cause and effect, will it not? So our consciousness is not free in this sense. Probabilistic at best.-> The evidence is the NDE experiences and research into them by several M.D.s starting in the 1960's and ongoing today, notwithstanding rather pitiful refutations by Blackmore in 1993. I admit we are still confused about consciousness since we have no definite answers, clearly expressed by Nagel.
Again more historical consciousness of dubious provenance.-Have to go to work now ... have a nice day.