DAVID: Biological complexity: mammalian pregnancy is a war (Introduction)

by David Turell , Tuesday, December 03, 2019, 16:19 (1817 days ago) @ dhw

DAVID: If God had not produced the bush of life, but only humans, they would not have survived! Again you are expecting a God with the ability to directly create humans without the bush, or create the whole bush.

dhw: They wouldn’t have survived without those parts of the bush of life that have enabled them to survive! Why do you ignore the 3.X billion years’ worth of bush that had nothing to do with humans? This is the illogical part of your theory, bearing in mind your claim that your always-in-control God’s only purpose was to create H. sapiens!

Your complaint is just a denial that evolution happened under the control of God. My plain belief is God started life with bacteria and eventually evolved humans as He increased the complexity of living beings.

DAVID: On the other hand you seem to accept evolution as God's work in experimentation, the same God who created the universe, the special Earth, and started life. You never look at the whole picture of why I believe from all the evidence.

dhw: If your God exists, then I have no problem with any of the above. My quarrel is with your theory that his sole purpose for all of it was to design H. sapiens, and you have no idea why he spent 3.X billion years specially designing anything but H. sapiens! Experimentation would cover the whole of the above, as would humans as a late arrival in his thinking, but “you never look at the whole picture”.

Total distortion. I have perfect ideas as to why God evolved humans in the time it took. that is history. Your 'no idea' jib is a twisted version of my intention not to question God's thinking or his choice. You have every right to question a god ( small 'g' intentional) you do not believe in from you humanistic view.

DAVID: Intricate design requires a designer. Evidence is seen in creation of this universe, creation of a perfect planet for life (Earth), fine tuning for life, creation of life, and then evolving a creature with consciousness. If all of this happened by chance, we are lucky to an infinite degree. Luck or purposeful?

dhw: You have skipped from evolution of life to evolution of the universe, thereby glossing over your particular theory concerning divine dabbling and first cells being provided with billions of programmes for the whole of life’s history, as opposed to (perhaps divinely designed) cellular intelligence. The latter theory is every bit as “purposeful” as the former.

DAVID: Cells are driven by intelligently designed processes and responses. They look intelligent.

dhw: Your usual statement of subjective opinion disguised as fact.

I only do it to show both sides are only opinion

DAVID: Shapiro's bacteria are forerunners of stem cells in my theory.

dhw: This is very interesting. I have frequently mentioned my suspicion that stem cells are the key to evolution, but you are in a far better position than I am to develop this idea. If you do so, please start a new thread.

Thank you. I'll dig into the idea when I have more time.