Cellular intelligence (Evolution)

by David Turell , Monday, February 07, 2022, 16:45 (800 days ago) @ dhw

DAVID: What you keep ignoring is a three-part problem. DNA from father and mother combine into baby DNA producing a new larger skull. Mother's pelvis must respond simultaneously. The cells from all three individuals do not communicate in a way that God can create an autonomous mechanism by themselves. […]

dhw: I asked you to read my post of 25 January, which dealt with this supposed example of your theory that your God speciates in advance of requirements – a theory already discredited elsewhere. This was my response:

My proposal is that new requirements (e.g. new tools, ideas, discoveries, environments) resulted in general brain expansion, which was heritable (as it must have been after your God's overnight operations), and which meant that over generations, brains grew bigger and so did babies... Please explain why you find this less credible than your fairy tale.[/i]"

You totally ignore the problem of three new DNA inputs in the new big skull problem. God cannot invent an independent mechanism to make the separate DNA's communicate in any meaningful fashion.

dhw: Yes, we differ...I suggest that the new cells are necessary to meet a new requirement, and the same cells continue to be used – through complexification – until once more their number needs to be increased to meet the next major new requirement.

DAVID: Ignoring not many new neurons are immediately used.

dhw: I didn’t know you had witnessed each phase of brain expansion and observed which neurons were not used. And my theory is not a “no-God scenario”!

A non-answer. Early sapiens did not use their brain as we do, the same brain!

Fire spot

DAVID: Your love of complexification is pure confusion. The advanced use of a new need, like London cabbies results in a thickened complexified area!!! That is a tiny example of enlargement, but we also know modern heavily used brains shrank 150 cc and also had London cabbie regions!!!

dhw: Yes, the odd instance of enlargement provides clear evidence that enlargement is also an autonomous process independent of your God’s involvement. Thank you for remembering that. But most of our requirements are met by autonomous complexification, not autonomous expansion. And shrinkage, yet again, is caused by the fact that cells which had been useful in the past are no longer needed because complexification has proved so efficient that it has made them redundant.

So you have decided complexification is not a God-given mechanism?

dhw: Why do you think the brain is now “fully” used? […]

DAVID: Our God-given brain can handle all the new knowledge in the future. No future expansion ever.

dhw: If it is going to be used in the future to handle all the new knowledge, how does that come to mean that our brain is already “fully used”?

We have added uses and knowledge for 315,000 years and it shrunk. Facts say it can handle any new use

Transferred from “More Miscellany”:
DAVID: The studies clearly show the inner workings of cells on information in their genome they follow.

dhw: The studies clearly show that some cells remain the same and some can change, and the latter sometimes appear to act intelligently […] the studies show that cells absorb, process, remember, communicate and act on the information they absorb. You believe your God provided them with instructions, some scientists believe the above processes denote autonomous intelligence, and I suspect many scientists would rather not delve into the possible source of what appears to be intelligence. Please stop kidding yourself that your theory is the norm.

DAVID: Enter ID to see their norm.

dhw: I was not aware that ID-ers now represented the norm in the scientific world. In any case, cellular intelligence and ID are not incompatible.

Many Ph.D. folks are in the ID corps. They all accept so-called cell intelligence is from God's design.