Introducing the brain: general (Introduction)

by dhw, Saturday, March 05, 2022, 08:37 (992 days ago) @ David Turell

DAVID: My reason previously given many times is in our brain many very complex pyramidal neurons appeared, requiring God's personal design.

dhw: So although your God can design a mechanism for the autonomous complexification of the brain, he couldn’t have designed a mechanism for very complex complexities.

DAVID: You still don't understand the need for intense mental activity behind creating complex designs. You don't hand off your play writing to a substitute, as a perfect example.

On the contrary, my point is that intense mental activity produces the complex designs. Whereas you argue that the complex designs are created in anticipation of intense mental activity. Your silly playwriting example would mean that your God handed creation over to some other god. As a playwright, like many other writers I know, I begin with an idea and allow it to develop of its own accord; I do not want to know in advance what is going to happen (otherwise I myself get bored with it), and am frequently surprised by developments, although I do always have the option to dabble (but rarely do). Thank you once again for an excellent analogy, even though you have repeated the same mistake as last time.

Physics current dead end

QUOTE: "The distribution of neurons in my brain is fractal, with density increasing as a power of D^2.decimal, much like Natalie’s description of Area^.75 power. It turns out that this is the optimal density to maintain connectivity between brain cells.

DAVID: Please note the bold about the design of our brain's neurons. Chance won't do that, only design will. Please remember my description of the specialized pyramidal neurons in five tiers dhw never dares comment about. It makes us very special.

I presume the quote applies to all brains and not just ours. I agree that we are very special, but I do not agree that your God would have operated on a group of sleeping homos to insert five tiers of specialized pyramidal neurons before there was any need for them. I suggest that our frontal lobe would have evolved from existing frontal lobes in response to new requirements, whatever these may have been. Here is a fascinating article which at first sight you will think confirms your beliefs, but which goes on to support my own proposals:

New Study Changes Our Understanding of Human ... - Haaretz.com
www.haaretz.com/archaeology/new-study-changes-everything-we-know-about-hum…

QUOTES: …these structural innovations in the cerebral regions, thought to allow for many of humans' unique behaviors and abilities were probably in place by 1.5 to 1.7 million years ago.

As we drove our dinner extinct, we had to develop capabilities and technologies to hunt down smaller, fleeter animals. We may also have needed increasingly to communicate in order to strategize the hunt for fast food. Right now this is speculative, but the truth is, it adds up.

It certainly does, though you will stick to your dabble of a few hundred thousand years ago.

DAVID: Note design in preparation:
https://www.the-scientist.com/the-literature/termite-brains-anticipate-future-visual-ch...

QUOTE: "Dampwood termites with the potential to leave the colony have larger optic lobes before ever being exposed to different visual environments, an example of predictive brain plasticity."

dhw: [...] I would guess that the origin of this particular variation is that if new colonies were to be founded, as the article says, it was essential that the founder should be able to cope with brighter conditions when leaving the nest (i.e. the ability first arose in response to a new requirement). Such is the nature of “castes” in termite society that this ability was passed on, just as other abilities were passed on to other castes. Of course this means the brain is plastic, but I don’t see the origin of the ability as being predictive: the ability would have arisen in response to an immediate need. To understand the whole history, we would need fossils of every stage of termite development. I doubt if we’ll find them.

DAVID: What a weak response. All you have done is insert your bias and refuted the point the author's made. A brain in anticipation of need!

The author makes no attempt to explain how such an ability originated. I see it as precisely the same process as pre-whale legs turning into flippers. You presumably have your God popping in to perform an operation on a few termites to prepare their eyes for the day when they will leave their nests to search outside in the light for a new location. (And somehow also in preparation for when humans will arrive a hundred million years or so later.) I have the termites realizing that accommodation is getting crowded, and they need to go and search. Over time, just as over generations legs turn into flippers from repeated usage in the water, the eyesight of the kings and queens improves over generations. The termite brain is plastic – it responds to new needs, just like ours. Please tell me why you find this explanation less believable than the divine one outlined above.

Rewiring memory
Zebra fish

All dealt with on the thread concerning your illogical theory of evolution.