Unanswered questions (General)

by David Turell @, Tuesday, August 27, 2019, 16:26 (1675 days ago) @ dhw

Transferred from “Balance of Nature; bees need meat”:

DAVID: For the umpteenth time, ID folks support the theory that God has designed all the irreducibly complex machines in living biochemistry. This means God ran evolution and created those designs. For me that translates to my theory about God and evolution. 'Covering time' is a nonsense notion since that is the time evolution took to reach the level of humans. And another nonsense idea is 'eating each other' as if it was not an absolute requirement in the process. A perfectly reasonable theory is God chose to evolve all of the bush of life ending with humans, whom I think are the endpoint.

dhw: For the umpteenth time, it is indeed a perfectly reasonable theory that if God exists, he chose to evolve the bush of life (either by direct design or by means of an autonomous inventive mechanism), and since humans are the latest new species, it is not unreasonable to believe that we are the endpoint. This is your usual selection of logical points, omitting those parts of your theory that combine to create its illogicality. The fact that H. sapiens is the latest species does not mean that your always-in-control God started out with the one and only purpose of creating us, or that he decided not to design the only thing he wanted to design until 3.X billion years had passed and therefore he had to cover the time in between by designing every other life form extant and extinct so that they could eat or be eaten by one another. I am delighted that you now agree that these are nonsense ideas. You have been promoting them for months and months, and they are encapsulated in the following statement:

DAVID: “He knew those designs were required interim goals to establish the necessary food supply to cover the time He knew he had decided to take.

DAVID: Misinterpreted. I mean God knew a great length of time was to be involved and took that time to do all the evolving required. By 'covering time' I mean using it, not inventing creations just to pass time.

dhw: 1) According to you he had DECIDED to take that great length of time (not he knew it would take that long), and for 3.X billion years he designed nothing but non-human life forms (so he never even started “evolving” us). Why, if his one and only goal was to design us?

Remember, Evolution requires starting with simple forms and finally reaching the most complex. It is a continuous process, and your comment implies He should have jumped to his goal. My answer above covers this.

dhw: Then, according to you, after this inexplicable decision:

2) All the other life forms were “interim goals” to provide food (eat or be eaten)to cover the time. Why “interim goals” if they were not designed with the purpose of keeping life going (“covering the time”) until he decided to design the only thing he wanted to design?

Again answered above. Econiches for food supply are an essential part of the process and you always dismiss them as "coming and going', which is true but totally and irrationally beside the point.


dhw: Thank you for at last agreeing that all this is nonsense.

Your nonsense, not mine.


dhw (referring to my summary of God’s thoughts according to your theory): I have put all your fixed beliefs together to show why they are illogical. You know perfectly well that each one is accurate, and so it is the illogicality of their combination that makes you see your own version of events as a caricature. And yes indeed, it makes a mockery of all logic.

DAVID: And I think it is totally logical that God chose to evolve all life, ending with humans. I have never understood why you think it is illogical.

dhw: I don’t. It’s the rest of your theory that is illogical, as you keep admitting when you say you have no idea why your God chose the evolutionary method you impose on him – see 1) and 2) above - and you therefore have to fall back on the claim that God’s logic is not ours! Why does God’s logic have to be different from ours if your theory is so logical?

How can I know why God makes the choices He does make? Adler warns His logic may not be like ours. You constantly humanize God.


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