Different in degree or kind: Sapiens begin brain use (Introduction)

by dhw, Wednesday, October 12, 2016, 12:20 (2746 days ago) @ David Turell

dhw: You can dress it up in as many ways as you like, but your dualism means that your God has given humans consciousness, and the brain to receive consciousness. Culture derives from thought, thought derives from consciousness, and the receiver of consciousness (the brain) is the material organ that translates thoughts into action. According to your dualism, it does not generate the thoughts, in which case it must develop materially in order to cope with the new demands.

DAVID: I accept your analysis of my thinking if it is clear that I am born to use and develop my consciousness. I control it and drive the plasticity of my brain by using it. I see nothing wrong with that approach.

Nor do I. The plasticity of the brain is indeed all-important, because if your dualistic beliefs are correct, it is your consciousness that changes your brain, not the other way round. This means that it was not the big brain that gave rise to thoughts of culture, but thoughts of culture that gave rise to the big brain.

DAVID: My point exactly. We are given a large frontal lobe H. sapiens brain first and then learn how to use it, exactly as the article describes. Form first, use second.
dhw: The article does not say God gave us a large frontal lobe. It doesn’t give us any clue as to how the frontal lobe got there. It simply speculates on when and how cultures evolved, and the author seems to think the first signs occurred 180,000-200,000 years ago, i.e. at the time when it is believed that the brain changed.

DAVID: I didn't mention God. Why do you? I just made a very strong point that form came first and then we learned how to use it by changing it by its provided plasticity.

Because when you say ”we are given”, there has to be a giver, and I know you well enough to assume that the giver is God. The "very strong point" I am making is that the article traces the beginnings of culture back to the time when we believe the brain complexified. According to your dualistic beliefs, this would mean thoughts of culture first, plastic brain complexification second. (See the Egnor thread for further development.)