Different in degree or kind: animal minds (Introduction)

by David Turell , Thursday, February 18, 2016, 00:52 (3202 days ago) @ dhw


> dhw: These quotes will suffice. If the evidence comes from observation and evolutionary theory, why is belief about animal emotions shaped by anthropomorphism and language? If someone threatens me with a gun, I will show all the symptoms of what we call fear. If you kick a dog, the dog will show all the symptoms of what we call fear. Fear is an emotion. Or the dog might even show anger - another emotion - and bite you back (serves you right!). -Of course animals, just as we do show raw emotion. But they do not conceptualize about it as we do. Or sit around discussing it as we do.-> 
> Clearly he has failed to notice the inescapable truth that we can never know what it is like to be another human being.-Solipsism! You are right.-> 
> dhw;If we can't KNOW it, let's ignore the evidence and let's not even keep an open mind. Let's just tell people animals don't feel emotions, because nobody can know whether they do or don't. Wonderful logic.-
I believe you are twisting the intent of his article. Again he cited Nagel and bats. That is the point. What they show may not be what we think they show.
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> dhw:	Scientists Declare Animals Are as Conscious as Humans (and ... 
> www.positivelypositive.com/2012/09/06/scientists-declare-animals...
> 
> "Last week, an international group of scientists signed The Cambridge Declaration on Consciousness, proclaiming their belief—based on decades of research—that animals are indeed conscious and capable of experiencing human emotions.-Of course animals are conscious. No on denies that. How much self-awareness do they have? A tiny amount. How much self-judgment? And I've agreed to basic emotions of their kind.
> 
> dhw: But perhaps we should ignore their decades of research, as they presumably haven't studied epistemology or read Adler.-Note, I'm not ignoring any of it. I'm just not romanticizing it, and I love my dog and horses and my barn cat who gets her daily petting.