Life's biologic complexity: Automatic molecular actions (Introduction)
DAVID: We are discussing whales. Entering a hostile aquatic environment with the requirement of a complex physiological new phenotype to me is an exercise in futility and makes no sense. Yes the animals do survive and are improved in the sense they achieve the ability to survive in water. But they are certainly lots more complex.
dhw: Why do you say the aquatic environment was “hostile”? How do you know it was more “hostile” than the land environment they decided to leave, perhaps once conditions had changed? Just as fish may have explored the land as offering new opportunities, pre-whales may have explored the water. “Wow, nice yummy fish here, and so easy to catch…This is the life, boys and girls!” What exactly is your theory?
How much swimming have you done in your life. If you and your wife decided to play house in the water, how would she give birth or nurse? This is some of the simple stuff land mammals had to reconfigure their bodies to do. Simple decision? Fish are yummy? Sounding whales can do so because of enormous changes in their lungs. The conversion from land to sea makes no sense to me unless evolution is a drive for complexity. Evolution certainly found it here.
dhw: That God preprogrammed/dabbled them to enter the water so that step by step they could become more complex, because although he really wanted to create humans, he needed step-by-step more complex whales in the water to balance nature so that life could go on until humans came? Does that make sense to you?
What makes sense to me is an evolutionary drive to complexity, that didn't care about what whacky branch evolution created. And have you noticed, human did arrive? I'm only theorizing from historical facts.
dhw:How does that explain why your God had to specially design the great bush of different species, 99% of which disappeared? You have admitted you don’t know (“Why He didn’t just start at the Garden of Eden, I cannot explain”), so why do you pursue this line of argument?
Because
I look at historical facts and try to make some logical sense of it.
DAVID: That cellular intelligence is supplied by God at the origin of life.
dhw: I thought you didn’t believe in cellular intelligence, so I’m delighted to hear that it is now a known research finding, but I do not know of any known research findings that confirm the existence of God.
Remember I believe God provided intelligent information in the layers of the genome from the very first life.
DAVID: Planning by an intelligent mind is required by the layers of genome complexity you refer to, which are discoveries by science, of which you are fully aware.dhw: The layers of genome complexity are indeed known research findings. What known research findings tell us these were planned by “an intelligent mind”?
No research. Logic. Only a planning mind can create the life we see.
DAVID: All of that leads to my theory of programming. Dabbling is a supposition of mine related to probable course correction in the process of evolution which might drift off course. God uses to evolution as a process to produce humans.dhw: I am aware of your theory, but not of the “known research findings” that support it. All you have come up with here are the layers of genome complexity, which fit in just as well with my cellular intelligence hypothesis as with your preprogramming/dabbling theory.
And you have no idea how a rocky planet invented intelligent life. God is obviously required. The evidence is well beyond a reasonable doubt for us who have come to believe. You don't want to accept the sum of the evidence.
Complete thread:
- Life\'s biologic complexity -
David Turell,
2011-06-08, 14:46
- Life\'s biologic complexity -
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2011-06-09, 00:04
- Life\'s biologic complexity - David Turell, 2011-06-09, 14:48
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- Life\'s biologic complexity -
David Turell,
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- Life\'s biologic complexity -
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2011-09-09, 15:26
- Life's biologic complexity: Automatic molecular actions -
David Turell,
2016-10-10, 00:00
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dhw,
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- Life's biologic complexity: Automatic molecular actions -
David Turell,
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dhw,
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dhw,
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dhw,
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- Life's biologic complexity: Automatic molecular actions -
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dhw,
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dhw,
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dhw,
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- Life's biologic complexity: Automatic molecular actions -
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dhw,
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- Life's biologic complexity: Automatic molecular actions -
David Turell,
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- Life's biologic complexity: Automatic molecular actions -
dhw,
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dhw,
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- Life's biologic complexity: Automatic molecular actions -
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dhw,
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dhw,
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dhw,
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dhw,
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dhw,
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dhw,
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dhw,
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dhw,
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dhw,
2016-12-29, 13:29
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dhw,
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- Evolution took a long time -
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dhw,
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dhw,
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dhw,
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dhw,
2016-12-22, 13:21
- Evolution took a long time -
David Turell,
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- Life's biologic complexity: Automatic molecular actions -
dhw,
2016-12-21, 18:01
- Life's biologic complexity: Automatic molecular actions -
David Turell,
2016-12-20, 19:24
- Life's biologic complexity: Automatic molecular actions -
dhw,
2016-12-20, 12:58
- Life's biologic complexity: Automatic molecular actions -
David Turell,
2016-12-19, 18:35
- Life's biologic complexity: Automatic molecular actions -
dhw,
2016-12-19, 12:54
- Life's biologic complexity: Automatic molecular actions -
David Turell,
2016-12-18, 21:51
- Life's biologic complexity: Automatic molecular actions -
dhw,
2016-12-18, 13:39
- Life's biologic complexity: Automatic molecular actions -
David Turell,
2016-12-17, 15:05
- Life's biologic complexity: Automatic molecular actions -
dhw,
2016-12-17, 13:47
- Life's biologic complexity: Automatic molecular actions -
David Turell,
2016-12-16, 20:17
- Life's biologic complexity: Automatic molecular actions -
dhw,
2016-12-16, 12:30
- Life's biologic complexity: Automatic molecular actions -
David Turell,
2016-12-15, 20:45
- Life's biologic complexity: Automatic molecular actions -
dhw,
2016-12-15, 16:53
- Life's biologic complexity: Automatic molecular actions -
David Turell,
2016-12-14, 18:41
- Life's biologic complexity: Automatic molecular actions -
dhw,
2016-12-14, 14:01
- Life's biologic complexity: Automatic molecular actions -
David Turell,
2016-12-13, 19:52
- Life's biologic complexity: Automatic molecular actions -
dhw,
2016-12-13, 13:12
- Life's biologic complexity: Automatic molecular actions -
David Turell,
2016-12-12, 17:40
- Life's biologic complexity: Automatic molecular actions -
dhw,
2016-12-12, 15:49
- Life's biologic complexity: Automatic molecular actions -
David Turell,
2016-12-11, 21:19
- Life's biologic complexity: Automatic molecular actions -
dhw,
2016-12-11, 13:13
- Life's biologic complexity: Automatic molecular actions -
David Turell,
2016-12-10, 22:36
- Life's biologic complexity: Automatic molecular actions -
dhw,
2016-12-10, 12:25
- Life's biologic complexity: Automatic molecular actions -
David Turell,
2016-12-09, 19:32
- Life's biologic complexity: Automatic molecular actions -
dhw,
2016-12-09, 17:33
- Life's biologic complexity: Automatic molecular actions -
David Turell,
2016-12-09, 01:06
- Life's biologic complexity: Automatic molecular actions -
dhw,
2016-12-08, 10:45
- Life's biologic complexity: Automatic molecular actions -
David Turell,
2016-12-07, 18:36
- Life's biologic complexity: Automatic molecular actions -
dhw,
2016-12-07, 13:02
- Life's biologic complexity: Automatic molecular actions -
David Turell,
2016-12-06, 16:24
- Life's biologic complexity: Automatic molecular actions -
dhw,
2016-12-06, 10:15
- Life's biologic complexity: Automatic molecular actions -
David Turell,
2016-12-05, 15:28
- Life's biologic complexity: Automatic molecular actions -
dhw,
2016-12-05, 13:58
- Life's biologic complexity: Automatic molecular actions -
David Turell,
2016-12-04, 17:33
- Life's biologic complexity: Automatic molecular actions -
dhw,
2016-12-04, 12:12
- Life's biologic complexity: Automatic molecular actions -
David Turell,
2016-12-03, 14:31
- Life's biologic complexity: Automatic molecular actions -
dhw,
2016-12-03, 13:33
- Life's biologic complexity: Automatic molecular actions -
David Turell,
2016-12-03, 00:28
- Life's biologic complexity: Automatic molecular actions -
dhw,
2016-12-02, 10:32
- Life's biologic complexity: Automatic molecular actions -
David Turell,
2016-12-01, 19:03
- Life's biologic complexity: Automatic molecular actions -
dhw,
2016-12-01, 13:08
- Life's biologic complexity: Automatic molecular actions -
David Turell,
2016-11-30, 15:33
- Life's biologic complexity: Automatic molecular actions -
dhw,
2016-11-30, 12:18
- Life's biologic complexity: Automatic molecular actions -
David Turell,
2016-11-29, 19:28
- Life's biologic complexity: Automatic molecular actions -
dhw,
2016-11-29, 11:31
- Life's biologic complexity: Automatic molecular actions -
David Turell,
2016-10-14, 01:47
- Life's biologic complexity: Automatic molecular actions -
dhw,
2016-10-13, 12:40
- Life's biologic complexity: Automatic molecular actions -
David Turell,
2016-10-12, 14:49
- Life's biologic complexity: Automatic molecular actions -
dhw,
2016-10-12, 12:16
- Life's biologic complexity: Automatic molecular actions -
David Turell,
2016-10-11, 18:47
- Life's biologic complexity: Automatic molecular actions -
David Turell,
2016-10-10, 00:00
- Life\'s biologic complexity -
David Turell,
2011-09-03, 15:38
- Life\'s biologic complexity -
David Turell,
2011-09-02, 14:53
- Life\'s biologic complexity -
David Turell,
2011-07-15, 02:09
- Life\'s biologic complexity -
David Turell,
2011-07-14, 15:05
- Life\'s biologic complexity -
George Jelliss,
2011-06-09, 00:04