New Miscellany Parts 1 &:2: evolution, intelligence, eco (General)

by David Turell , Tuesday, May 06, 2025, 19:38 (3 days ago) @ dhw

Evolution

DAVID: Your fantasies are now hallucinations. All dogs can think as can all prey animals

dhw: As can all other animals, birds, insects, fish. And even single-cell bacteria, which have no brains, can think. That's how they all survive. It is YOUR fantasy/hallucination that your God has to teach possums to play dead, weaverbirds to build their nests…in fact to give instructions to all cells (including our own immune cells) to become the enemy or to resist the enemy, as well as to change their structures in order to meet or exploit new conditions. Indeed, so fantastic is your belief that you attribute the eventual FAILURE of 99.9% to make those changes, not to limited cellular intelligence but to your God’s own incompetence, because despite his omnipotence and omniscience, he has designed and had to cull them as they were not what he wanted to design! None of this excludes the theory of a God that designed cellular intelligence. But you refuse to recognize that dog-eat-dog = a free-for-all which DEMANDS the autonomous intelligence at both strategic and physical levels, which you keep rejecting.

I said above all prey animals think, as can all predators. Not single cells in organisms. They fallow strict instructions for minor adjustments.

Mind and cosmos

dhw; So when you and I disagree about your God’s existence, nature, purpose, method, you think he is arguing with himself and passing his thoughts onto us. We are merely “tapping into his mind”.

The theory is we use His consciousness structure to form our consciousness..

Theoretical origin of life

DAVID: For the umpteenth time, God evolved us in a cumbersome way, but that was His choice. It was quite effective. We are here running the world.

dhw: We could also still be here running the world if he had WANTED the species you say he designed and culled: for example through a free-for-all (perhaps with occasional interventions), experiments to discover the potential of his invention etc. Why MUST he be a messy, cumbersome, inefficient designer, when history allows an interpretation that has him designing precisely what he wants to design? Ah, but you “first choose a God I wish to believe in. The rest follows.”” Why do you wish to believe in an inefficient designer?

I fully accept God's methods.

Whale’s contribution to nutrition

dhw: How ironic, that the most intelligent beings on the planet should be using their expertise to destroy the planet and themselves!

DAVID: At least no more whaling!

dhw: Good point, except that some countries – e.g. Japan – are still killing them. But you can hardly blame them when you realize that the USA continues to expand its already huge fossil fuel industries, which will have vastly more impact on our “ability to balance the global carbon budget”.

DAVID: Just accept your Petrol will cost less.

dhw: Even that is doubtful, but why should I just “accept” the fact that thousands more people will die because fossil fuels are toxic? And just to anticipate your response: no, I’m not arguing for immediate banning of fossil fuels. That would be impractical and indeed ruinous in the modern world. I’m arguing for a practical phasing out, geared to intensified research on alternatives. Destroying the world’s economic and social systems would be just as ruinous as continuing the practices that are currently destroying the environment.

Fools' logic! Fossil fuels will never be stopped in use.