New Miscellany (General)

by dhw, Thursday, February 06, 2025, 12:14 (28 days ago) @ David Turell

First life

You have abandoned the subject of 70,000,000 years being a surprisjngly short time for the development of life and therefore evidence of design. I presume you have now realized that as there are no criteria, your surprise and evidence were without any foundation.

Evolution

DAVID: Yes, I'm fully aware just 0.1% survived, but look at the glorious result: the magnificent variety of living resources for human to use.

dhw: Your statement had nothing to do with the wonders of the present world. Your claim that “All that evolved is here today for our use” is sheer nonsense, because approx. 99% of what evolved is not here today, and could not have been for our use. Only 1% is here today, and even that does not mean it was all designed for our use!

DAVID: When one realized God did it as His goal, it all makes sense.

How can it make sense if your God’s one and only goal was to design the 1% but he also designed and then disposed of 99% which had nothing to do with his goal? That is why you ridicule him as being a messy, inefficient designer!

T-cells and immunity

dhw: You challenged my point that millions of people died from cancer, which means your God’s 3.8-billion-years-old instructions failed in millions of cases. Another example of his inefficiency. Why do you keep ridiculing him? Maybe you’re wrong, and he did NOT issue instructions 3.8 billion years ago! Let’s consider your new entry on the same subject:

(No need to repeat the quotes.)

DAVID: […] This could not develop by chance since it manages the diet of hominins from
early Erectus to sapiens over millions of years, constantly changing antigens to handle.

dhw: I don’t know why you’ve singled out hominins, since these experiments were carried out on mice. I agree as regards chance. The article shows how the process has developed through cells communicating, adapting, changing roles and cooperating in response to different demands at different times. And so maybe instead of your God issuing inefficient instructions 3.8 billion years ago, he gave cells the autonomous ability to make their own designs and decisions, and success or failure depended on them and not on him. Worth considering? Or do you still insist on your God's inefficiency?

DAVID: My use of the word inefficiency applied only to His use of evolution. Don't expand its meanings to specific DNA instructions.

I have said that this is another example of his inefficiency: if millions of people die in spite of his 3.8-billion-year-old instructions, then clearly his instructions don’t always work. That = inefficiency.

The brain

dhw: I have pointed out that the brain is a community of cell communities, all of which cooperate with one another. If your God gave our brain cells autonomy, why do you think he was incapable of giving autonomy to all cells?

DAVID: It was not required While you constantly plead for nonexistent intelligent deigning cells.

dhw: What was not required? Some sort of intelligence was/is required for survival, adaptation and innovation. You plead for a 3.8-billion-year-old set of instructions which sometimes fail, but you agree that our brain cells do their own intelligent designing. Why do you think it is impossible for God to have given the same ability to all kinds of cells?

DAVID: Neurons self-design following instructions.

More word games. Are you now saying that every design made by your brain cells was predetermined 3.8 billion years ago? If not, what did these “instructions” consist of?

Extremophiles

dhw: Nobody will deny that this portion has conditions suitable for life! That does not mean that the unknown rest of the universe is also “fine-tuned” for life.

DAVID: It is assumed so.

An assumption based on 5% and ignoring 95% leaves a lot to be desired.

dhw: And we needn’t dwell on your absurd belief that every species and ecosystem for the first 3.X000,000,000 years of life’s history was specially designed for the sake of the humans who were not even around at the time.

DAVID: All evolutionary preparation for our arrival.

dhw: There we go again! 99% of species and ecosystems had no connection with us and our food. You have confirmed above that only 1% have evolved into the current world, but you still disagree with yourself.

DAVID: I don't slice up a continuous evolution as you do.

The continuity consists of the 1%. There is no continuity for the 99%. They went extinct. Remember?