Immunity system complexity: how T cells are triggered (Introduction)

by David Turell , Wednesday, April 03, 2019, 17:52 (1847 days ago) @ dhw

QUOTES: For the first time ever, scientists have imaged the process by which an individual immune system molecule is switched on in response to a signal from the environment, leading to the critical discovery that the activation process involves hundreds of proteins suddenly coming together to form a linked network through a process known as a phase transition."

"This is something that happens inside a living cell during the process of the cell making a decision—signal transduction is what we call it—and it's how cells 'think' with chemical reactions," said study leader Jay Groves. (DAVID’s bold)

DAVID: Note the bold. The direct implication by the quoted scientist, is that cells 'think' with automatic molecular reactions that cause the proper necessary result, my point all along in these discussions. Since infections are a constant threat to life, living organisms could not have been brought into existence unless these immune mechanism were present from the beginning, by design. Please look at the complexity of the molecules structure shown on the website, which also makes as strong case for design. Cells do not think, but automatically react swiftly to all stimuli by their designed reactions of complex organic molecules.

dhw: I can’t find the word “automatic” anywhere in this article, but all thought – including our own – is accompanied by automatic molecular reactions, and indeed materialists claim that all thought is engendered by molecular actions and reactions. I have no doubt that once the cells have learned to combat particular infections, the responses will be automatic, but with each new infection, the mechanisms will have to take new decisions, which in turn will be passed on. I have no problem with the concept of design: whether or not the original mechanism (I propose cellular intelligence) was designed by your God, I would suggest that its subsequent evolution would have been the result of the cells learning to cope with an ever increasing number of infections – or in billions of cases not learning, since individual organisms and whole species die from disease, thus raising the question of why, in your hypothesis, your God created a mechanism which didn’t work half the time. Please remember, when stating so authoritatively that "cells do not think", that although you have every right to stick to this belief, you have now acknowledged that your rejection of “cellular intelligence” puts you in a scientific minority.

DAVID: The bolded section, by me, in the first quote doesn't have to say 'automatic' but that is what the statement describes!

dhw: I have agreed at the very beginning of my response (now bolded) that all thought is accompanied by automatic molecular (re)actions. I’m afraid this really isn’t an answer to any of the points that I have raised, especially with regard to your would-be authoritative statement that “cells do not think”.

That is not what Groves said. He specifically says cells thought process is the activation of chemical reactions. He does not discussing preceding thought. That is your pet theory, not supported by his quote.