Consciousness: hard problem not solvable? (General)

by dhw, Wednesday, September 18, 2019, 09:02 (1892 days ago) @ David Turell

QUOTE: "If our experience of action doesn’t really affect what we do in the moment, then what is it for? Why have it? Contrary to what many people believe, I think agency is only relevant to what happens after we act – when we try to justify and explain ourselves to each other." (DAVID’S bold)

DAVID’s comment: Libet did not interpret correctly. The bold considers agency a feeling after we act. That sounds correct to me.

dhw: If the feeling that we are the agents responsible for our actions is only relevant AFTER we act, how does that come to mean that it is relevant BEFORE we act?

DAVID: I feel I am fully in charge beforehand while deliberating as well as afterward.

Exactly. So you disagree with him!

DAVID: You have totally misinterpreted his meaning. Our feeling of full control (free will) does appear after we decided what to think or do. That is my feeling of my decisions.

dhw: I’m not disputing that we feel responsible afterwards. I’m disputing that we do not feel responsible before our actions, when we are in the process of making our decision. (I’d better repeat that I am disputing his argument, but I am not defending or attacking the concept of free will.) I don’t know why you are supporting an argument with which you profoundly disagree, or why you think that “only after” includes “before”!

DAVID: Explained above. The no-free-will folks believe the brain, own its own, influences our thoughts. I feel I run my brain, even though it is a wet-computer which helps us see, feel our reality in an indirect way.

I was simply pointing out that free will requires “agency” BEFORE the act. For some reason, you have supported the bolded statement at the start of this post, although it contradicts your own beliefs! This is a non-discussion.