Cosmology: Inflation theory under attack part 3 (Introduction)

by dhw, Thursday, October 26, 2017, 12:37 (2584 days ago) @ David Turell

DAVID: Of course I reject, because I also keep in mind the ultimate purposes I think guide God. Even if He cannot have full control, He will nudge the processes until He achieves what He wants.
dhw: If you agree that the processes can be out of his control although he can dabble (nudge) if he wants to, then it makes perfect sense to suggest that he actually wants them to be out of his control (i.e. allows the process to run freely) but can dabble (nudge) if he wants to. And that is the theistic scenario I have suggested and you have rejected.
DAVID: Why would He want to dabble if He doesn't want control. Your idea makes no sense.

Of course it makes sense. He sets the free-for-all process in motion, but if he doesn’t like what he sees, or gets tired of it, he intervenes. In other words, he only takes control if he wants to. On the other hand, looking at your scenario, if he is NOT in full control, how can he dabble and be sure to get what he wants?

dhw: And so you jump from the irrelevance of “balance of nature” to evolution. You and I both believe history shows that all multicellular organisms, including humans, evolved. According to you, your God preprogrammed or dabbled “instant” species (the Cambrian) but for some unknown reason chose to “muck about” (reblak) with loads of hominins and hominids before producing the one species he really wanted: Homo sapiens. This apparently is explained by the fact that God’s logic is different from ours.
DAVID: Evolution requires balance of nature. You agree to that.

Evolution can only take place if life goes on. Nobody could possibly disagree. “Balance of nature” means nothing more than that at different times different organisms are able to cope with different environmental conditions and therefore to survive.

DAVID: The evolution of Cambrians showed development of new species over millions of years, no different than a few million years for human development. Evolution is evolution whenever and for how long it happened. 'Mucking' all along, don't you notice.

Under “Cosmology: how the universe evolved”, I wrote: “I thought your explanation for the Cambrian was an almighty dabble of instant creation, since species appeared to spring from nowhere.” You replied: “First life also is an almighty dabble, remember? Dabble and evolve.” Now apparently there is nothing special about the Cambrian after all – no almighty dabble, just evolution going the same old way. I’m happy with that. It fits in perfectly with my hypothesis that speciation of all kinds “mucks along” as different organisms devise different organs and strategies in the constant drive for survival and/or improvement. No overall plan, and especially no plan that links whales, nests and shrinking shrew skulls to the production of Homo sapiens’ brain.

DAVID’S comment (on “energy and shrew brains”): Brains use lots of energy. This is an unusual adaptation to for the problem, but there is less food in winter. How the adaptation developed is unknown, but it involved reabsorption of skull plates which may have forced brain shrinkage. It is so massive a change it is akin to speciation. Research into this mechanism may unearth some information about speciation. And, if God arranges for new species, this may afford an insight into His methods.
dhw: Marvellous how organisms adapt. Looks to me like the work of those damned intelligent cell communities finding ways to cope with environmental conditions. If God exists, this would be a great example of his method of giving control to organisms to work out their own means of survival. But I suppose you will tell us that he controlled the shrewy shrinkage by dabbling or preprogramming it 3.8 billion years ago, so that life would continue until he could fulfil his primary purpose of producing the brain of Homo sapiens.
DAVID: Shrewdly the shrews adapted either epigenetically, by a mechanism provided by God, or He stepped in. Either is possible, Only more research may tell us in the future.

Yes, the mechanism of cellular intelligence that organizes epigenetic adaptation, which as you say is “akin to speciation”, may have been provided by your God. I’d be a bit surprised if he shrewdly preprogrammed the shrewy shrinkage 3.8 billion years ago or even did a dabble, since apparently all he really wanted to do was produce the brain of Homo sapiens.