Pointy eggs and whales (Evolution)

by Balance_Maintained @, U.S.A., Tuesday, September 11, 2018, 00:01 (95 days ago) @ David Turell
edited by Balance_Maintained, Tuesday, September 11, 2018, 00:08

TONY: That said, as any father would want to teach his son, perhaps this has also been in part to help his son attain fullness in his own right. Perhaps, being the first to exist, the first to know an understand anything, he realizes that life is, in and of itself, perhaps the greatest purpose there is, and sees creating a fullness of it as to be the highest calling he could aspire to. The bible refers to him as 'the living god', and it also mentions that his son did not have 'life in him' from the beginning, but through his endeavors it was put into him (though I also think limited human language muddies the water there).

DHW: I’m puzzled by this answer. You complained that we did not ask for the purpose of everything, as opposed to just our purpose. Now you seem to be offering us two purposes: 1) Your God teaching his son to attain “fullness”; 2) Your God creating fullness of life. By “everything”, I thought you meant the universe and all life, which would include every form of life that has ever existed, including our own. Perhaps, though, you could explain what you mean by “fullness”. Meanwhile, I have offered a theistic purpose (God’s wish to relieve his own boredom by creating an ever changing spectacle) in the paragraph with which I have opened this post. I’d be surprised if you agreed with it, but if you don’t, it would be interesting to know why, and it would be interesting to know how your God’s hoped-for attainment of Jesus’s "fullness" explains the billions of solar systems and the billions of life forms and natural wonders extant and extinct.

Tony: Actually, allow me try breaking it down in point-by-point logic:

1: There is/was/will ever be, energy.
2: This energy, however it happened, became self-aware and grew in organization (lived)
3: As the organization (self-awareness) grew, it realized that growth and organization (life/fullness/self-actualization) is a purpose in and of itself.
4: It grew in its own fullness.
5: It reached a point where it realized that it could not grow further in isolation (became aware of the possibility of reproduction)
6: It reproduced for the first time. (First direct creation)
7: It helped its spawn grow its awareness.
8: It realized that, like it, its spawn would need to 'reproduce' to achieve fullness.
9: It realized that this process would have to continue infinitely, each new awareness growing and spreading.
10: Pondering the situation, it decided on a course of action that would accomplish both tasks, creating life/organization/self-awareness in a system that could continuously expand and grow infinitely(for all intents and purposes)
11: It worked through its offspring, allowing its offspring to grow along one trajectory, while it grew along another, possibly with the intent that at some point its offspring would start its own cycle while it continued to grow in new directions.

In this line of thinking, God is not only the progenitor, but also always at the head of the growth curve, always more advanced, always in the lead. The offspring, being aware of this, always follows the direction of its progenitor.

David: I've always said pure energy first.

It occurs to me that the entity( God )may be God particularly because he can directly violate the law of first law of thermodynamics, creating energy/mass where none existed previously.
That literally makes God the possible source of infinite creation and destruction. If energy, mass, and information are equivalent at the quantum level, then he would also be a possibly infinite source of information, simply by being able to violate that law of physics.

Personally, I view the soul as energy in the form of a memory, stored energy, inert when not bound to an object, a dormant file on your computer; a tiny spark of energy on God's flash drive waiting to be accessed to do something. So if God can destroy the soul, the ability to destroy energy seen.

From a biblical perspective, "Fear not he that kills the body, but cannot destroy the soul." implies that there is something that transcends physical death, regardless of our beliefs on the form. When Christ says 'by the will of his father', he was literally using his Father's power(i.e. not power he created).

When life was 'put in to Christ', it could mean that he gained the ability to create energy in his own right, a defining hallmark thing he needed to learn to learn in some Godly rite of passage, or it could be that as a young God in training (think Teenage God) he needed guidance to balance some aspect of his Godly personality, or to test it, as we do with our teenage children. Not in terms of 'bugs in the software of creation' type test, but in a 'allow your child to demonstrate their depth of empathy/compassion/perserverence' type test to prove to themselves and others that they are worthy.

What is the purpose of living? How about, 'to reduce needless suffering. It seems to me to be a worthy purpose.

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