Genome complexity: what genes do and don't do (Introduction)

by David Turell , Friday, February 01, 2019, 14:33 (1912 days ago) @ dhw
edited by David Turell, Friday, February 01, 2019, 15:00

DAVID: You still seem totally confused about the issue of information in the genome. I see the cells as actively entering their genome for instructions to be activated. The information is always available, just as you enter a library to review a subject from inactive books. As Davies points out life runs on information.

dhw: The genome is part of the cell, so you now have the cell consciously entering part of itself to look for instructions to tell it how to use the part of itself which it has entered....And you have now gone back on your original agreement that information (a passive data base) “cannot possibly serve as instructions”. You also agreed when I wrote: “I would say, then, that life “runs on” cells being aware of and actively using the passive information that is lying there inactive.” Life does not run on information, it runs on the active use of passive information. But you think I’m confused.

This is just semantics. What I bolded in your comment is correct. My library analogy is correct. A library is passive, but one can actively use it. Cells use their library of information in the genome. There are instructions telling cells how to act. Note the entry on stickleback fish evolution. ( 2019-01-31, 01:22 )

From the thread on Paul Davies:
dhw: I would like to know what Davies believes actually does the information processing, i.e. what it is that chunters away inside living cells and “manipulates” or “exploits” information. (“Life” doesn’t exploit anything – that is done by living organisms.)

DAVID: This is all concepts about the use of information in the genome. Obviously the information in the genome is available for the cells to use. We still don't have a laid-bare description of how it works.

No, we haven’t. But you think your cells enter their genome to look for one set of instructions out of billions passed down through 3.8 billion years. I suggest that cells actively use passive information to work out the best way to deal with new conditions.***

DAVID: When I first introduced the concept of information running life to you, you were startled and resisted the idea. I won't bother looking for quotes.

dhw: I am still startled, and I still resist it. Once more: information is passive, and it is the use of information that runs life, but we don't know how cells are able to use the information. You agreed when I said so, but now you disagree.

Above I haven't disagreed.

DAVID: Yes, exactly. The genome creates the structure of organisms and offers ways for appropriate responses to stimuli.

dhw: I did not say the genome offers ways to respond! The genome, as you agreed earlier, offers nothing but passive information which “cannot possibly serve as instructions”. The genome can be restructured, but we do not know what organizes the restructuring. See above*** for two unproven hypotheses.

There must be a misunderstanding. I don't understand the bolded quote. It does not represent any of my thinking. I have always viewed the genome as creating structure, but also instructions for biochemical reactions and also responses to stimuli. I'd like to see the entire context of the quote.