Evolution and humans: Neanderthal lungs larger (Evolution)

by David Turell @, Friday, November 09, 2018, 18:41 (10 days ago) @ dhw

DAVID: No 'hope in producing' involved. God knew full well what He wanted, but He chose not to do it directly, but to evolve it. Webs don't equal humans, as in your belittling statement without logic, but are part of the progress.

dhw: I didn’t say webs equalled humans! What is without logic is the notion that your God wanted H. sapiens and chose to specially design 50,000 webs, large Neanderthal lungs and the weaverbird’s nest as part of the progress towards producing H. sapiens.

We agree life needs energy. The diversity in life and in your esamples supplies that. Nothing more.

DAVID: All I can assume, if I conclude that God chose evolution as His method, which is obvious in that evolution happened, without entering His mind, which I cannot, His purpose was humans. All logical without knowing God's logic, which I cannot.

dhw: If God exists, clearly he chose evolution as his method – but his method to do what? You admit that you cannot understand the logic of his personally, individually dabbling or preprogramming the 50,000 webs (plus a billion other natural wonders extant and extinct) if humans were his purpose, but you refuse to consider the possibility that he might have had a different purpose and might have given spiders the intelligence to weave their own webs.

How do you know what His purpose was? I look at the evidence and the most complex result of evolution is humans, so as I think God ran the process of evolution that was the result He desired. No mind reading, just looking at the current result for a conclusion.


DAVID: The energy was provided. That is fact. How would you have provided it? By a different diversity or the one we see? Either way it would have provided the energy needed. The lungs, nests and webs are side issues you create, while agreeing design is necessary.

dhw: Same problem. The energy needed for what? Energy is necessary for all life forms, but that does not mean that all life forms were created for the purpose of producing H. sapiens! Yes, I believe that lungs, nests and webs must be designed, and I accept the possibility that in my hypothesis the ability of organisms to do their own designing may have been given to them by your God. I do not accept that your God personally designed them all as part of the progress towards H. sapiens, and I do not accept that an illogical explanation is more likely to be true than a logical explanation, just because we don’t know how God thinks.

The illogical conclusion is in your mind, not mine. The variety supplies the energy for a long living evolutionary process.


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