Logic and evolution (Introduction)

by David Turell @, Wednesday, July 13, 2016, 00:01 (615 days ago) @ dhw

dhw: “Steering evolution toward humans” could be done by dabbling, and this would allow for the combination of what you call “hands off” (complete autonomy) and “control” (God dabbling for his own purposes). Then we wouldn't have to wonder why he is so concerned about the weaverbird's nest that he has to design it himself - as if life could not go on without it!

You keep making a nest a major issue, but I don't see it that way. It is part of a micro niche in the balance of nature. It is part of the enormous variety presented by life styles and life forms. All on the way to reach humans. Are not the humans the pinnacles of complexity? To the point that I presented today the comment today that many scientists think evolution is over.

dhw: But that is the “possibility” you seem unable to accept: that organisms such as insects and weaverbirds may be capable of intelligent design without your God's guidance.

Minor adaptations, yes, speciation, no.

dhw: I can understand how an “advancing” mutation might jettison inherited information that is no longer necessary. But please explain why saltations that introduce new inventions such as kidneys, brains, sex, the senses etc. would require or result in a loss rather than a gain of information.

They referring to adaptations, not species changes in the loss of info. No one knows how species appear and what happens with info. It is a black box so far.

DAVID: Thank you. Cells can modify their DNA as Shapiro shows, which changes the use of information and this suggests that all the information needed for evolution may have been present from the beginning.

dhw: Once again, I cannot follow your logic. The ability of cells to modify their DNA is essential for evolution to advance. And so the potential for acquiring information from outside and for changing information inside must indeed have been present from the beginning if we believe in common descent.

Of course.

dhw: ....That does not mean that every possible response (adaptive and innovative) to every future environmental change was “present from the beginning”. So please explain precisely what you mean by “all the information needed for evolution” in this context.

The only evidence we have so far is adaptations result from a loss of information. If one extrapolates this finding to the process of speciation, it is a possible speciation occurs solely from a loss of information, which means all the info needed for evolution was present from the beginning.

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