Dualism (Identity)

by Balance_Maintained , U.S.A., Friday, March 27, 2015, 20:22 (3528 days ago) @ dhw

Let me answer your last statement first.->DHW:You base this on texts which now even you have admitted are unreliable - apart from the JW translation, which apparently alone can claim to be the Word of God, though even then it can't avoid openness to different interpretations.-That is not what I actually said, and in fact made no reference to the JW translation at all. I said translations that were made AFTER the dead sea scrolls were found, of which there are many. -
> DHW: ...You have now attributed near-death experience of a conscious spirit to the work of Satan, and have offered biblical quotes in support of your argument. Among the quotes was Psalm 146, which appeared to contradict your belief in a memory stick containing all the information of the dead person. 
> TONY: Not just NDE's. All instances of communication with dead spirits. 
> 
> Psalm 146 still contradicts your belief in the memory stick. I gave you four biblical references to communication with dead spirits, including the parable in Luke (and I still find it odd that Jesus told such a story if he didn't believe in talking spirits, or heaven and hell). Matthew 17, 1-5 has Jesus chatting with Moses and Elijah (who turns out to have returned unrecognized as John the Baptist). In 1 Samuel, 28, Saul commands a medium to contact Samuel, which she does, and Samuel speaks to Saul. In Revelations, the souls of those slain for their beliefs call out to God to avenge them. Presumably, then, Matthew and the authors of Samuel and Revelations have been tricked by Satan - but then we can hardly say these texts are the Word of God, can we?
>-Yes, and Saul was condemned for doing so because he directly violated a mandate from God. I don't have time at the moment to do a lot of research on this one, though, so I will have to revisit it later.-
>DHW: I have indeed translated many books covering a vast range of subjects, and there is no doubt that a comma can change the meaning of a sentence. So why do you complain about “people trying to cherry pick commas to prove an otherwise scriptural doctrine, the meaning and intent is crystal clear”? I note that in my Watchtower translation of Samuel, the raised spirit is not referred to as Samuel, but as “Samuel”. Where did the translators get the inverted commas from? In Luke's account of Jesus's promise to his neighbour, as you pointed out, the word order and punctuation have been adjusted to completely change the meaning. I have asked you many times which version of the Bible is the Word of God. Now you are agreeing that some translations are not the Word of God. Thank you. Unless you are an expert in Ancient Hebrew, Aramaic and Greek, how can you even begin to judge the accuracy of any translation? Experts disagree anyway. Do you really think Jehovah's Witness translators are more objective and knowledgeable than any others?
> -Other translators seem to think they are more objective and knowledgeable. However, that was not my point. To answer you question directly, it honestly doesn't matter which translation you use. If you study the bible, and allow the context of the bible to inform you views as opposed to other doctrines and traditions, then you can still arrive at the truth. -
 
>DHW: Nobody, including you, knows what happened to Christ during the three days after his physical death. I'm not sure what you mean by “resurrection to a spiritual form”. You have told us that the spirit returns to God without consciousness, which it only regains when the body has been resurrected and the memory stick inserted. So please clarify: did Jesus return from the dead, appear to the disciples (once apparently walking through walls, since the doors had been locked), and ascend to heaven in his own physical, memory-stick-reinforced body, or as a conscious spirit?-
Sometimes I hate the English language, too many words have multiple meanings. I hesitated to initially use the word 'spirit' when referring to the 'back-up'. I also hesitated to use 'spiritual form' when talking of Christ's resurrection because I KNEW you were going to do just this. When Christ was resurrected it was in a non-physical form. When you 'spirit' (memory stick) returns to God, that is also in a non-physical form. Are the two non-physical forms similar in composition? I do not know. -
> 
>DHW: As always, I must repeat that I don't understand NDEs and have an open mind about their implications.-Repeat it all you like, but for some reason it does not feel as if your mind is actually all that open to the implications. -
>DHW:hat I am challenging is your assumption that the sometimes very moving stories of love and reunion (plus the acquisition of information they could not otherwise have known) are all part of Satan's evil plan to make people act AGAINST the very God they believe in and worship. -
But I thought you were "open mind about their implications."

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What is the purpose of living? How about, 'to reduce needless suffering. It seems to me to be a worthy purpose.