Dualism (Identity)

by Balance_Maintained , U.S.A., Friday, March 13, 2015, 20:55 (3542 days ago) @ dhw

xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
> 
> TONY: During NDE's and OBE's the body is not completely dead. It still provides energy and an 'anchor' of sorts, if you will. More importantly, if NDE's or OBE's are remembered then apparently the brains functions have not entirely ceased. Either that, or there is some form of buffer between the consciousness and the brain. This would act sort of like RAM in my computer analogy, storing data in the form of energy until it could be written more permanently to the hard disk (brain).
> 
>DHW: In your computer analogy, you specifically said that consciousness was the equivalent of an independent user, and you said that NDEs confirmed this analogy. It's clear from your entire post, however, that this is not the case, and consciousness does depend on the material self, so you are not a dualist. May I then assume you believe that your consciousness emerges from the brain and eventually dies with the brain, unlike David's, which is a quantum pattern of energy that the brain receives from God and that goes back to God when we die?-Consciousness IS an independent user, in a sense. The mistake you are making here is a form of absolutism. Nothing, aside from perhaps God, is absolutely independent. Everything is dependent upon something. Like any analogy, if you take the computer analogy too far, it will of course fall apart because it is only an analog not an exact duplicate of the situation. -It is independent in the sense that, even if the brain, body, information, or energy is damaged, corrupt, or even missing for a limited time, it can still function. It is independent in the sense that it can examine or even diagnose any of the other elements. It is independent in the sense that it can exert direct control over the other elements. There have even been reported cases of where a person "wills" themself to die, and others where the consciousness has simply given up and caused the rest to die. Much like shutting down a computer because you don't want to play anymore.-There actually is Biblical writings that do indicate that the energy returns to God, but I do not believe that energy is conscious, at least not in the form we are discussing. I tend to think it is more like backing up the hard drive before scrapping an old computer so that the information can be restored at some point. You can have all the data in the world, but without a consciousness to experience it, it is just data. It is not alive.

--
What is the purpose of living? How about, 'to reduce needless suffering. It seems to me to be a worthy purpose.