Dualism (Identity)

by Balance_Maintained , U.S.A., Sunday, March 22, 2015, 00:23 (3534 days ago) @ David Turell


> > dhw: Closeness to God need not denote being in heaven. David will correct me if I'm wrong, but as far as I know there are lots of NDEs who simply meet dead relatives. No specific mention of heaven, although very often there is great tranquility.
> 
>David: Many do describe Heaven, but you are correct. One of my patients, the day before he died, saw dead friends sailing by his bedroom window on water flowing by. They (NDE'rs) always see dead. Story related by his wife.-Now consider this:-If Heaven and Hell are real, why do they see dead people floating around outside windows?
if Heaven and Hell are NOT real, why do they report visiting heaven and seeing their relatives there?
If the dead are conscious, then are they in heaven, hell, or here?
If the dead are NOT conscious, then who was it that they saw?-
Now, working from a biblical standpoint, let's apply some logic. If the dead ARE conscious and in either heaven or hell, then there would be no ghosts floating around for your NDEr's to see, in which case the NDEr's who reported it are either lying or have been had. -If the dead are conscious but there is no heaven or hell, then the NDEr's who reported visiting heaven are either lying or have been had. -If the dead are not conscious, then both groups (those that reported heavenly dead ones and those that reported earthly dead ones) are either lying or have been had. -If we accept the bibles postulates that:
(a) The dead are conscious of nothing
(b) That there are other spirit creatures in existence (angels and demons)
(c) That there is a struggle going on among those creatures concerning God's right to rule.
(d) That the struggle included which side humans would choose to be on. -Then what we have is the following scenario:-There are no conscious dead human spirits on earth, in heaven, or in hell. That spirit creatures are using a form of propaganda/deception to garner support for their side of the battle.-This is the only scenario that both (a) Explains why NDEr's see anything at all, (b) why they see different things, (c) does not require them ALL to be liars.

--
What is the purpose of living? How about, 'to reduce needless suffering. It seems to me to be a worthy purpose.