A possible God's possible purpose and nature (The nature of a \'Creator\')

by dhw, Friday, May 28, 2021, 13:25 (1067 days ago) @ David Turell

dhw: On this thread, we are trying to work out what your God’s purposes and nature might be, basing our speculations on different possibilities. Previously you argued that he wished to create life because he wished to create humans and their food supply. But if there is no life elsewhere, he just wished to create billions of galaxies because….?

DAVID: We don't know why God made this universe in this form. In my view God doesn't wish. He has a designer's purpose.

May 26 @ 19.11:
dhw: If God exists, I’d find it a bit strange that he would confine his interests to a single planet, let alone a single species plus food supply. One can’t help asking why else he would create the billions of galaxies.

DAVID: Why ask? I simply accept what we see as God's wish to create.

He wished to create billions of galaxies, I ask why, and you tell me he doesn’t wish to create but he has a designer’s purpose. So...if there is no life or only primitive life elsewhere, why do you think he would have designed billions of galaxies?

dhw: If there IS life elsewhere, he wished to create it because...

DAVID: God does not wish. It is possible life is elsewhere and God designed it there. As stated before He may want humans or human-like elsewhere.

He couldn’t have “wished” to create them but he could have “wanted” to create them…and what’s more, he could have created them, and I am asking you why you think he might have done so. What is the point of telling us that your God has a designer’s purpose and then refusing to discuss what that purpose might be!

(I’m skipping the issue of abiogenesis, as that is a different topic.)

DAVID: Why can't God start life elsewhere? That is what I think. It doesn't disturb me. Why can't it even evolve to brilliant humans or their equivalent?

dhw: It could do. I’m considering all options and their implications for our vision of a possible God.

DAVID: Some of your inventive options are currently without answers from research.

Of course. If research had provided the answers, we would not need to discuss any of our subjects.

DAVID: We Earthlings are special focal point here. We can accept other Earths might be special and support life and might evolve specialized life forms comparable to humans. Why not? Why can't God have several focal points in the universe? It answers you unreasonable weird worry God made the universe unnecessarily too big.

dhw: Yes, if millions of galaxies are home to millions of life forms, the size makes sense. But if you have millions of Earths with millions of human-like life forms, your God will have millions of focal points, and so the claim that we are a “special focal point here” – which has always been your contention – becomes a little unconvincing.

DAVID: Why can't God have multiple focal points? Not unconvincing at all. All we can know is this Earth.

True. But it was you who brought our attention to the possibility of life among the other billions of galaxies, and so I thought it might be worth discussing the possible implications. This one seems to be that unless there are more humans out there, even you can't think why he would have designed the billions of galaxies. I thought your explanation that it was simply due to “God’s wish to create” might be well worth developing, but presumably you’ve now decided you’d rather not go down that road! I wonder why.

dhw: The questions I’m asking relate to the different options. No life at all begs the question: why such a big universe? Bacteria only: not much of a purpose, is it? Human-similar: that’s the really interesting one for us: why would he want to create humans?

DAVID: We've made multiple guesses as to His purpose. Lets not review.

dhw: And also, since you believe in an afterlife: What aspects of your God’s purpose and/or nature do you think an afterlife might reflect?

DAVID: It is a matter of acceptance, and your problem of doubt and questioning. It is amazing both you and I are here to debate. Dayenu.

I agree that it’s amazing. But there’s not much point in our being here to debate if you simply say we must accept your belief that God exists, designed every species de novo, his sole intention was to design humans, he must have had a “good” reason for designing all the “bad” bacteria and viruses, and we are going to live on after death but we shouldn’t ask why.