Proof of ID (Introduction)

by xeno6696 , Sonoran Desert, Tuesday, December 17, 2013, 21:07 (3994 days ago) @ David Turell


> > dhw: I am proposing that cells and cell communities "might have a designing intelligence of their own", and like every other human on this planet, I don't know where any form of intelligence came from.
> 
> Fair enough. And where might that independent source of intelligence in the cells be hiding? No evidence other than biochemical reactions so far.
> -And to me this seems to undermine you... if the only evidence is biochemical reactions... than there is no basis to leap off towards a creator. The biochemical reactions can be an answer unto themselves. -> 
> > dhw:So a "limited number of responses" covers "all responses" to all situations, which have been preprogrammed in and passed down by the first living cells and thus account for every single innovation, adaptation, lifestyle and strategy of every organism that ever lived (apart from the divinely dabbled).......I really do wonder how many programmes your God could have squeezed into those first few cells. However, this hypothesis of yours allows you to "reject out of hand" the alternative that your God might have created a flexible form of intelligence that enabled organisms to create their own innovations as and when circumstances allowed or demanded them, e.g. the collective intelligence of the fire ants produced the raft. I demand equal rights for Matt and myself!
> 
> Matt and you can gang up, but you have no idea any more than I do how variation is driven if chance has no chance of working. At least I can show the biochemical processes that have been found. After that all I have is supposition, and remind you that the obvious push to create humans got no drive from the demands of nature.-Chance does have a chance at working. And I'm with dhw, I think its more likely that independent cells are more than mere automatons and can influence their own direction (albeit limited physically).

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\"Why is it, Master, that ascetics fight with ascetics?\"

\"It is, brahmin, because of attachment to views, adherence to views, fixation on views, addiction to views, obsession with views, holding firmly to views that ascetics fight with ascetics.\"