Intelligence (Origins)

by David Turell , Sunday, March 24, 2013, 20:23 (4051 days ago) @ Balance_Maintained


> Tony: We know animals are conscious. So we do "know" there are levels of consciousness other than our own. Presuming to be the highest form is mere arrogance. -Frans de Waal on animal thinking capacity. They obviously do and can collate inventive thought to a degree, but of course, nothing like we can.:-http://online.wsj.com/article/SB10001424127887323869604578370574285382756.html?KEYWORDS=Frans+de+Waal-
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> > dhw: Everything? I have strong feelings about many subjects, but until I'm confronted by convincing (to me) evidence for 1) the existence of God, and 2) convincing (to me) explanations for the source of life and of consciousness, I'll keep an open mind. If, in this context, being unable to commit myself to any one fabrication of reality means fabricating my own reality, I plead guilty to the charge, though I don't understand its logic.
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> Tony:I would conjecture, as I have previously, that unless you were able to sit down and have tea with God himself, you would not believe. (Yes, I am exaggerating slightly for effect... a firm handshake and an impromptu miracle might be enough...) The point being, all jokes aside, you have never qualified what you would consider evidence, thereby precluding the possibility of anyone every presenting you with any evidence other than direct observation; a standard so rigorous that even science doesn't demand it(dark matter/energy/gravity).-The best evidence is the fractured theory of evolution. Chance is not an option as dhw admits. My Talbott entry just preceding this shows how organism- directed it is. The screams from the Darwinists over their loss of 'junk' DNA, a prime timber in their edifice, are a kind of inverted proof. How much self-directed complexity in the genome do you need before a rational person must admit that a designer is a necessary conclusion?