philosophy of science: meaning and functions (Introduction)

by Balance_Maintained , U.S.A., Sunday, September 23, 2018, 18:01 (2252 days ago) @ dhw

PART ONE

DHW: Why is being proud and wanting credit less human than being bored with isolation?

David is the one with issues about assigning human qualities to God. If we are made in his image, I have no real issue with it other than to say his ways are not our ways, they are higher than are ways. As for the difference, if you did something, then taking credit for it, even wanting the credit for it, is simply wanting the truth to be known. Would you want people believing, and spreading, lies about you? In our society we view that as so vile that we have laws against it and punishment for it.

TONY quoting dhw: ".. but it also allows for “selfish amusement” and indifference to suffering."

DHW:... we can only guess at your God’s nature through his works, and so of course the spectacle allows for this interpretation!

You stated that you did not say such things, I was merely illustrating that you do, in fact, say such things. Still why would someone whose primary quality was selfish indifference and indifference to suffering bother creating so much beauty, and give us the capacity to enjoy it?

DHW: In order (= purpose) to relieve his boredom he creates a spectacle that enables him to grow and develop. It might help us, though, if you explain how he grows and develops. Could it be that he extends his own experience by creating a world full of love and hate, beauty and ugliness, joy and pain?

I don't think he, being a sentient living being(of a sort), would willingly inflict pain upon himself. I think he did something good that brought joy, and something happened that screwed it up in such a way that, in a sense, his hands were tied for a while. Saying that he created pain for his own experience is like saying a person without cancer would suck down a full course of chemotherapy drugs just for kicks. Yes, I agree that loneliness might have been the initial motivation to start creating. The counter question, though is, once he had created more than one, why create more? Your bored and lonely idea breaks down once there are more than a few entities in existence. And, it would logically be far easier to create creatures of pure energy like himself, so why make the jump to the material world in a mostly empty universe if he was just bored and lonely.

TONY: Saying that he did it purely for entertainment, amusement, or as a cure for boredom are all forms of capriciousness or frivolity, literally "not having any serious purpose or value".

You quoted me as saying: “….perhaps I should not use the word “entertainment”, as people do tend to associate it with amusement”. Let me then state with all seriousness that I regard the relief of isolation and boredom as an extremely serious purpose. Indeed loneliness and lack of any kind of occupation are a huge human problem in our day and age. I can well imagine that the prospect of eternity spent in isolation with nothing to do would be

pretty unbearable. Can't you?

Yes, which is why I stated that I agreed with that as first cause, but not as an ongoing cause.

TONY (later): For god to create one offspring, your idea of boredom and/or loneliness is likely spot on.

DHW: Then why all this opposition to the idea? If he could create one offspring to end the boredom of isolation, why shouldn’t he have created the whole spectacle of life for the same reason? And I really don’t see why you insist that Christ was his only direct creation, especially when Genesis tell us that it was God who dunnit!

Because you criticize what you have not bothered to study or learn. In reference to Christ:

Col 1:15-17 The Son is the image of the invisible God, the firstborn over all creation. For in Him all things were created, things in heaven and on earth, visible and invisible, whether thrones or dominions or rulers or authorities. All things were created through Him and for Him. He is before all things, and in Him all things hold together.…

John 1:2-3 He was with God in the beginning. Through him all things were made; without him nothing was made that has been made.

Prov 8:23 He was with God in the beginning.Through him all things were made; without him nothing was made that has been made.

TONY: Further, it implies that when he grows bored with us, we will just get tossed aside too, because He is indifferent to the suffering of others that he allowed for his own 'selfish amusement'. […]

DHW:... Life as we know it contains as much pain as it does joy, and it is faith not reason which enables some people to believe in a loving, caring God.

Oh, life does indeed contain pain. I've never questioned that. I do question the source of that pain, however. What my observations show is a virtual paradise that has been decimated by people unwilling to follow directions. Why would I blame God for that?

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What is the purpose of living? How about, 'to reduce needless suffering. It seems to me to be a worthy purpose.