philosophy of science: meaning and functions (Introduction)

by Balance_Maintained @, U.S.A., Sunday, September 16, 2018, 17:00 (303 days ago) @ dhw

TONY: From a biblical perspective, he is still unique, despite having created other powerful beings. (Elohim literally means powerful ones, and his title literally is "most powerful one"). There is even implications in the Bible that at some point humanity has the potential to become "like god", though to what extent is still unclear.

DHW: Previously you thought science was the “best evidence”, but I always get the impression that you regard the Bible as the best evidence! Anyway, we now have your God creating powerful spiritual beings who are like him but less powerful. Why do you think he did that?

I don't see the disparity between the Bible and Science that most people claim exists. In fact, I see that Science routinely confirms the Bible. Until I find something that utterly disproves the bible, I will continue to see it as a vital source of thought about reality. As to the second part, I think he did it for multiple reasons. First, to grow himself. By creating others, he gives himself room to grow in a way he could not alone. Secondly, from a biblical perspective, His first born son was his first creation, and all other things were created through and for his Son. Yet his Son claimed that he did all things by the will of his Father, and gave his Father all the credit. So to me, all of this is an act that teaches his greatest qualities to His son, justice, power, wisdom, and love in exquisite balance, a fact confirmed in Revelation when the four symbols of these qualities finally bow to the son and proclaim him worthy to continue his Father's work. That said, they are both cited as loving their creation, so at smaller scales, we will find purposes that are specific to each level of creation, all born out with justice(balance), power, wisdom, and love.

DHW: According to Genesis 1:26 God said: “Let us make man in our image, according to our likeness”, so we’re not unlike himself, are we? But in any case, why couldn’t he have created these other superbeings to extend his own experience? Surely Satan must have taught him a thing or two – he really livened things up, didn’t he?

No, we are not unlike God. Even more interesting is that it is the combination of the tree of knowledge and the tree of life that would have made us 'Gods'. Also the fact that God himself supposedly claimed that humanity was capable of anything they set their hand to.

I have explicitly said that part of his purpose was to extend his own experience. He also created them as workers to further his own designs, and more importantly, gave them the free will to choose whether or not to do so. However, I don't see it as entertainment, but rather as education, or growth. Yes, Satan did liven things up...he challenged God's right to rule. And that political rebellion will eventually end in a most spectacular fashion.

DHW: Sorry, I’m not sure what you’re referring to here. Single prototype of what? A practice universe? A practice cell? A practice human? I thought these superbeings were different from us.

His first born son was unique. He was the only thing created directly by God. Everything else was created through the son, by God's will and using God's power. Of course, it also talks about work being delegated down the line to other creatures as well. So, the original source creates a single entity. Then teaches that entity over an unknowable period of time. Then together they produce other entities of the same type (spiritual)(Colossians 1:16). Then all of them working together began creating the material world. What exactly their role was in such things, it doesn't say, but their name literally means 'messenger', and there are numerous accounts of them doing all manner of tasks.

TONY: Third, from a biblical perspective, he let others do much of the work of creating the universe, but he supplied the power and knowledge.

DHW: This, I must confess, is new to me. I thought he did it all himself, but now apparently he created all these other powerful beings as a workforce. Well, at least that explains their purpose. He needed help.

What, you thought the angels just sat around on fluffy clouds playing harps? I am not sure if 'help' is the right word, but it will do for now.

DHW: I have to say I see very little difference between your concept of the “purpose of everything” and my own theistic hypothesis. Your God had had enough of his isolation, and wanted something other than himself to focus on so that he could have a fuller existence. Sort of relieving the boredom, wouldn’t you say?

TONY: That still seems a trivial summary compared to growth.

DHW: I interpret your “growth” and "development” as a fuller existence through an expansion of his experience, which could not have happened without him ending his isolation. See above. Why is that trivial?

Labeling it as entertainment to relieve boredom trivializes it. Did you marry your wife because you were bored? Would you have ever said that of yourself to her face? Or have children because you were bored? Or maybe you provided good things and taught them good things because you were bored? If I characterized the entirety of all the works of your hands through your entire life as "Maybe DHW was just bored" would you feel as if I had just trivialized everything you've done?

What is the purpose of living? How about, 'to reduce needless suffering. It seems to me to be a worthy purpose.

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