An inventive mechanism: A DNA 'Shapiro change' (Evolution)
David's comment: This modification is just what Shapiro has championed. A dramatic editing of DNA removing the metabolic stress of producing enzymes by finding a simpler way of manufacturing photosynthesis products. Still the same species! Doesn't show how speciation occurs and is no support for Darwin's original thesis.
dhw: There are three points here that we have discussed over and over again. Firstly, NOBODY knows how speciation occurred, and that is why we theorize. Secondly, what part of Darwin’s original thesis are you talking about? Common descent? Natural selection? Or the same old random mutations plus gradualism that you and I have long since agreed to discount?
DAVID: I accept common descent, but I remain doubtful about the importance of natural selection. It becomes active only when presented with alternative organisms, so it is basically passive in advancing evolution. Survival of the fittest is a tautology, and worthless.
So which part of Darwin’s thesis is not supported by genetic modification?
dhw: Thirdly, it is not only such modifications that Shapiro has championed, but also the all-important factor of cellular intelligence, which means that “Where’s there a will there’s a way” is to be taken literally. Please give us your “theological explanation” for Prochlorococcus’s amazing talent.
DAVID: I think God gave unicellular organisms the ability to edit their DNA for adaptations to changes in environment, but not to the degree of actual speciation, in agreement with what Shapiro presents.
Yes, if Shapiro subscribed to the theistic version, he might say God gave cells the INTELLIGENCE to edit their DNA. (Remember, he believes in cellular intelligence.) We do not know whether that intelligence extends so far as to create the multicellular innovations that cause speciation. That is why it is a hypothesis.
Complete thread:
- An inventive mechanism -
dhw,
2014-08-30, 12:11
- An inventive mechanism -
dhw,
2014-08-30, 12:29
- An inventive mechanism -
Balance_Maintained,
2014-08-30, 21:27
- An inventive mechanism -
David Turell,
2014-08-31, 01:02
- An inventive mechanism -
Balance_Maintained,
2014-08-31, 04:08
- An inventive mechanism -
David Turell,
2014-08-31, 06:18
- An inventive mechanism -
Balance_Maintained,
2014-08-31, 08:12
- An inventive mechanism - David Turell, 2014-08-31, 16:28
- An inventive mechanism -
Balance_Maintained,
2014-08-31, 08:12
- An inventive mechanism -
David Turell,
2014-08-31, 06:18
- An inventive mechanism -
Balance_Maintained,
2014-08-31, 04:08
- An inventive mechanism -
dhw,
2014-09-01, 13:20
- An inventive mechanism - David Turell, 2014-09-01, 18:59
- An inventive mechanism -
David Turell,
2014-08-31, 01:02
- An inventive mechanism -
Balance_Maintained,
2014-08-30, 21:27
- An inventive mechanism -
David Turell,
2014-08-30, 23:36
- An inventive mechanism -
dhw,
2014-09-01, 13:01
- An inventive mechanism - David Turell, 2014-09-01, 18:39
- An inventive mechanism -
David Turell,
2014-09-02, 05:02
- An inventive mechanism -
dhw,
2014-09-02, 20:50
- An inventive mechanism - Balance_Maintained, 2014-09-02, 21:04
- An inventive mechanism -
Balance_Maintained,
2014-09-02, 21:28
- An inventive mechanism - David Turell, 2014-09-03, 02:00
- An inventive mechanism -
dhw,
2014-09-03, 22:00
- An inventive mechanism -
Balance_Maintained,
2014-09-04, 04:44
- An inventive mechanism -
dhw,
2014-09-05, 12:48
- An inventive mechanism - David Turell, 2014-09-05, 19:23
- An inventive mechanism -
Balance_Maintained,
2014-09-05, 20:42
- An inventive mechanism -
dhw,
2014-09-06, 11:40
- An inventive mechanism -
David Turell,
2014-09-06, 19:21
- An inventive mechanism -
dhw,
2014-09-08, 12:15
- An inventive mechanism -
David Turell,
2014-09-09, 00:59
- An inventive mechanism - David Turell, 2014-09-09, 22:10
- An inventive mechanism -
dhw,
2014-09-10, 11:34
- An inventive mechanism - David Turell, 2014-09-10, 19:44
- An inventive mechanism -
David Turell,
2014-09-09, 00:59
- An inventive mechanism -
dhw,
2014-09-08, 12:15
- An inventive mechanism -
Balance_Maintained,
2014-09-06, 21:29
- An inventive mechanism - David Turell, 2014-09-06, 22:40
- An inventive mechanism -
dhw,
2014-09-08, 12:21
- An inventive mechanism -
Balance_Maintained,
2014-09-08, 21:13
- An inventive mechanism -
dhw,
2014-09-10, 11:21
- An inventive mechanism - David Turell, 2014-09-10, 19:32
- An inventive mechanism -
Balance_Maintained,
2014-09-10, 21:42
- An inventive mechanism -
David Turell,
2014-09-11, 16:00
- An inventive mechanism -
Balance_Maintained,
2014-09-11, 20:19
- An inventive mechanism -
David Turell,
2014-09-11, 21:53
- An inventive mechanism -
Balance_Maintained,
2014-09-12, 08:15
- An inventive mechanism -
David Turell,
2014-09-12, 20:37
- An inventive mechanism -
Balance_Maintained,
2014-09-13, 00:52
- An inventive mechanism -
David Turell,
2014-09-13, 16:39
- An inventive mechanism -
Balance_Maintained,
2014-09-13, 21:05
- An inventive mechanism -
David Turell,
2014-09-13, 21:57
- An inventive mechanism -
Balance_Maintained,
2014-09-14, 03:39
- An inventive mechanism -
David Turell,
2014-09-14, 05:55
- An inventive mechanism - Balance_Maintained, 2014-09-14, 10:35
- An inventive mechanism -
David Turell,
2014-09-14, 05:55
- An inventive mechanism -
Balance_Maintained,
2014-09-14, 03:39
- An inventive mechanism -
David Turell,
2014-09-13, 21:57
- An inventive mechanism -
Balance_Maintained,
2014-09-13, 21:05
- An inventive mechanism -
David Turell,
2014-09-13, 16:39
- An inventive mechanism -
Balance_Maintained,
2014-09-13, 00:52
- An inventive mechanism -
David Turell,
2014-09-12, 20:37
- An inventive mechanism -
Balance_Maintained,
2014-09-12, 08:15
- An inventive mechanism -
David Turell,
2014-09-11, 21:53
- An inventive mechanism -
dhw,
2014-09-11, 20:27
- An inventive mechanism -
David Turell,
2014-09-11, 22:21
- An inventive mechanism -
dhw,
2014-09-13, 09:30
- An inventive mechanism -
dhw,
2014-09-16, 12:29
- An inventive mechanism -
David Turell,
2014-09-16, 19:09
- An inventive mechanism -
dhw,
2014-09-17, 20:34
- An inventive mechanism -
David Turell,
2014-09-17, 22:06
- An inventive mechanism -
dhw,
2014-09-18, 18:22
- An inventive mechanism -
David Turell,
2014-09-22, 19:50
- An inventive mechanism -
dhw,
2014-09-23, 12:55
- An inventive mechanism -
David Turell,
2014-09-23, 15:05
- An inventive mechanism -
dhw,
2014-09-24, 15:28
- An inventive mechanism -
David Turell,
2014-09-25, 19:42
- An inventive mechanism -
dhw,
2014-09-26, 12:49
- An inventive mechanism -
David Turell,
2014-09-26, 15:05
- An inventive mechanism -
dhw,
2014-09-27, 16:50
- An inventive mechanism -
David Turell,
2014-09-28, 01:56
- An inventive mechanism -
dhw,
2014-09-28, 20:24
- An inventive mechanism -
David Turell,
2014-09-29, 00:34
- An inventive mechanism: Transposition - David Turell, 2014-09-29, 15:15
- An inventive mechanism -
dhw,
2014-09-29, 16:01
- An inventive mechanism -
David Turell,
2014-09-30, 15:25
- An inventive mechanism: polyploidy? - David Turell, 2014-10-01, 15:05
- An inventive mechanism -
dhw,
2014-10-01, 20:01
- An inventive mechanism -
David Turell,
2014-10-02, 02:32
- An inventive mechanism -
dhw,
2014-10-02, 18:23
- An inventive mechanism -
David Turell,
2014-10-02, 19:23
- An inventive mechanism -
GateKeeper,
2014-10-03, 14:30
- An inventive mechanism - David Turell, 2014-10-03, 14:41
- An inventive mechanism - David Turell, 2014-10-04, 01:27
- An inventive mechanism: 3-color vision - David Turell, 2014-10-03, 14:45
- An inventive mechanism -
dhw,
2014-10-03, 18:18
- An inventive mechanism -
David Turell,
2014-10-03, 20:00
- An inventive mechanism -
dhw,
2014-10-04, 15:48
- An inventive mechanism -
David Turell,
2014-10-04, 19:47
- An inventive mechanism; Read this essay -
David Turell,
2014-10-05, 15:30
- An inventive mechanism; Read this essay -
dhw,
2014-10-06, 12:25
- An inventive mechanism; Read this essay -
David Turell,
2014-10-06, 23:43
- An inventive mechanism; Read this essay -
dhw,
2014-10-07, 16:09
- An inventive mechanism; Read this essay - David Turell, 2014-10-07, 18:31
- An inventive mechanism; Reviewing Talbott - David Turell, 2014-10-09, 02:19
- An inventive mechanism; Read this essay -
dhw,
2014-10-07, 16:09
- An inventive mechanism; Read this essay - David Turell, 2014-10-07, 01:46
- An inventive mechanism; Read this essay -
David Turell,
2014-10-06, 23:43
- An inventive mechanism; Read this essay -
dhw,
2014-10-06, 12:25
- An inventive mechanism -
dhw,
2014-10-05, 21:33
- An inventive mechanism -
David Turell,
2014-10-06, 00:01
- An inventive mechanism -
dhw,
2014-10-06, 12:16
- An inventive mechanism -
David Turell,
2014-10-06, 15:57
- An inventive mechanism -
dhw,
2014-10-07, 15:53
- An inventive mechanism -
David Turell,
2014-10-07, 18:05
- An inventive mechanism: Tacoma bridge adddendum - David Turell, 2014-10-08, 01:42
- An inventive mechanism -
dhw,
2014-10-08, 13:12
- An inventive mechanism: another outside discussion -
David Turell,
2014-10-08, 19:02
- An inventive mechanism: another outside discussion -
dhw,
2014-10-09, 20:15
- An inventive mechanism: another outside discussion -
David Turell,
2014-10-10, 02:15
- An inventive mechanism: another outside discussion -
dhw,
2014-10-10, 15:31
- An inventive mechanism: another outside discussion - David Turell, 2014-10-10, 17:58
- An inventive mechanism: another outside discussion -
dhw,
2014-10-10, 15:31
- An inventive mechanism: another outside discussion -
David Turell,
2014-10-10, 02:15
- An inventive mechanism: another outside discussion -
dhw,
2014-10-09, 20:15
- An inventive mechanism -
David Turell,
2014-10-08, 20:21
- An inventive mechanism -
dhw,
2014-10-09, 19:39
- An inventive mechanism -
David Turell,
2014-10-10, 01:36
- An inventive mechanism: bed bugs - David Turell, 2014-10-10, 15:05
- An inventive mechanism -
dhw,
2014-10-10, 15:26
- An inventive mechanism -
David Turell,
2014-10-10, 17:53
- An inventive mechanism -
dhw,
2014-10-11, 12:45
- An inventive mechanism -
David Turell,
2014-10-11, 15:22
- An inventive mechanism -
dhw,
2014-10-12, 11:41
- An inventive mechanism -
David Turell,
2014-10-12, 15:02
- An inventive mechanism - dhw, 2014-10-13, 16:41
- An inventive mechanism -
David Turell,
2014-10-12, 15:02
- An inventive mechanism -
dhw,
2014-10-12, 11:41
- An inventive mechanism -
David Turell,
2014-10-11, 15:22
- An inventive mechanism -
dhw,
2014-10-11, 12:45
- An inventive mechanism; developing multicellularity -
David Turell,
2014-11-06, 15:27
- An inventive mechanism; developing multicellularity -
Balance_Maintained,
2014-11-07, 06:42
- An inventive mechanism; developing multicellularity -
dhw,
2014-11-07, 13:18
- An inventive mechanism; developing multicellularity - David Turell, 2014-11-07, 16:36
- An inventive mechanism; developing multicellularity -
David Turell,
2014-11-07, 16:03
- An inventive mechanism; developing multicellularity -
David Turell,
2015-02-05, 15:34
- Developing multicellularity; bacterial example -
David Turell,
2015-05-25, 15:29
- Developing multicellularity; poor lab example -
David Turell,
2015-07-03, 04:57
- Developing multicellularity; from a virus? - David Turell, 2018-02-17, 14:40
- Developing multicellularity; poor lab example -
David Turell,
2015-07-03, 04:57
- Developing multicellularity; bacterial example -
David Turell,
2015-05-25, 15:29
- An inventive mechanism; developing multicellularity -
David Turell,
2015-02-05, 15:34
- An inventive mechanism; developing multicellularity -
dhw,
2014-11-07, 13:18
- An inventive mechanism; developing multicellularity -
Balance_Maintained,
2014-11-07, 06:42
- An inventive mechanism -
David Turell,
2014-10-10, 17:53
- An inventive mechanism -
David Turell,
2014-10-10, 01:36
- An inventive mechanism -
dhw,
2014-10-09, 19:39
- An inventive mechanism: another outside discussion -
David Turell,
2014-10-08, 19:02
- An inventive mechanism -
David Turell,
2014-10-07, 18:05
- An inventive mechanism -
dhw,
2014-10-07, 15:53
- An inventive mechanism -
David Turell,
2014-10-06, 15:57
- An inventive mechanism -
dhw,
2014-10-06, 12:16
- An inventive mechanism -
David Turell,
2014-10-06, 00:01
- An inventive mechanism; Read this essay -
David Turell,
2014-10-05, 15:30
- An inventive mechanism -
David Turell,
2014-10-04, 19:47
- An inventive mechanism -
dhw,
2014-10-04, 15:48
- An inventive mechanism -
David Turell,
2014-10-03, 20:00
- An inventive mechanism -
GateKeeper,
2014-10-03, 14:30
- An inventive mechanism -
David Turell,
2014-10-02, 19:23
- An inventive mechanism -
dhw,
2014-10-02, 18:23
- An inventive mechanism -
David Turell,
2014-10-02, 02:32
- An inventive mechanism -
David Turell,
2014-09-30, 15:25
- An inventive mechanism -
David Turell,
2014-09-29, 00:34
- An inventive mechanism -
dhw,
2014-09-28, 20:24
- An inventive mechanism -
David Turell,
2014-09-28, 01:56
- An inventive mechanism -
dhw,
2014-09-27, 16:50
- An inventive mechanism -
David Turell,
2014-09-26, 15:05
- An inventive mechanism -
dhw,
2014-09-26, 12:49
- An inventive mechanism -
David Turell,
2014-09-25, 19:42
- An inventive mechanism -
dhw,
2014-09-24, 15:37
- An inventive mechanism - David Turell, 2014-09-25, 02:16
- An inventive mechanism; another adaptation -
David Turell,
2014-09-25, 15:11
- An inventive mechanism: nylon eating bacteria -
David Turell,
2014-11-10, 22:10
- An inventive mechanism: nylon eating bacteria -
dhw,
2014-11-11, 13:34
- An inventive mechanism: nylon eating bacteria - David Turell, 2014-11-11, 14:00
- An inventive mechanism: nylon eating bacteria -
dhw,
2014-11-11, 13:34
- An inventive mechanism: nylon eating bacteria -
David Turell,
2014-11-10, 22:10
- An inventive mechanism -
dhw,
2014-09-24, 15:28
- An inventive mechanism -
David Turell,
2014-09-23, 15:05
- An inventive mechanism -
dhw,
2014-09-23, 12:55
- An inventive mechanism -
David Turell,
2014-09-22, 19:50
- An inventive mechanism -
dhw,
2014-09-18, 18:22
- An inventive mechanism -
David Turell,
2014-09-17, 22:06
- An inventive mechanism -
dhw,
2014-09-17, 20:34
- An inventive mechanism -
David Turell,
2014-09-16, 19:09
- An inventive mechanism -
dhw,
2014-09-16, 12:29
- An inventive mechanism -
dhw,
2014-09-13, 09:30
- An inventive mechanism -
David Turell,
2014-09-11, 22:21
- An inventive mechanism -
Balance_Maintained,
2014-09-11, 20:19
- An inventive mechanism -
David Turell,
2014-09-11, 16:00
- An inventive mechanism -
dhw,
2014-09-10, 11:21
- An inventive mechanism -
Balance_Maintained,
2014-09-08, 21:13
- An inventive mechanism -
David Turell,
2014-09-06, 19:21
- An inventive mechanism - David Turell, 2014-09-06, 15:32
- An inventive mechanism -
dhw,
2014-09-06, 11:40
- An inventive mechanism -
dhw,
2014-09-05, 12:48
- An inventive mechanism -
David Turell,
2014-09-04, 06:11
- An inventive mechanism - dhw, 2014-09-05, 12:37
- An inventive mechanism -
Balance_Maintained,
2014-09-04, 04:44
- An inventive mechanism -
David Turell,
2014-09-03, 02:18
- An inventive mechanism: role of horizontal gene transfer -
David Turell,
2014-11-28, 15:41
- An inventive mechanism: role of horizontal gene transfer -
dhw,
2014-11-29, 11:57
- An inventive mechanism: role of horizontal gene transfer -
David Turell,
2014-11-29, 15:49
- An inventive mechanism: role of horizontal gene transfer -
dhw,
2014-11-30, 19:52
- An inventive mechanism: role of horizontal gene transfer -
David Turell,
2014-12-01, 00:58
- An inventive mechanism: role of horizontal gene transfer -
dhw,
2014-12-01, 17:28
- An inventive mechanism: role of horizontal gene transfer -
David Turell,
2014-12-02, 17:40
- An inventive mechanism: role of horizontal gene transfer -
dhw,
2014-12-03, 18:00
- An inventive mechanism: role of horizontal gene transfer -
David Turell,
2014-12-03, 22:17
- An inventive mechanism: role of horizontal gene transfer -
dhw,
2014-12-04, 17:49
- An inventive mechanism: A DNA 'Shapiro change' -
David Turell,
2016-11-27, 15:23
- An inventive mechanism: A DNA 'Shapiro change' -
dhw,
2016-11-29, 09:03
- An inventive mechanism: A DNA 'Shapiro change' -
David Turell,
2016-11-29, 19:37
- An inventive mechanism: A DNA 'Shapiro change' -
dhw,
2016-11-30, 12:23
- An inventive mechanism: A DNA 'Shapiro change' -
David Turell,
2016-11-30, 15:38
- An inventive mechanism: A DNA 'Shapiro change' -
dhw,
2016-12-01, 13:13
- An inventive mechanism: A DNA 'Shapiro change' -
David Turell,
2016-12-01, 19:09
- An inventive mechanism: A DNA 'Shapiro change' -
dhw,
2016-12-02, 10:37
- An inventive mechanism: A DNA 'Shapiro change' -
David Turell,
2016-12-03, 00:32
- An inventive mechanism: A DNA 'Shapiro change' - David Turell, 2021-01-22, 23:29
- An inventive mechanism: A DNA 'Shapiro change' -
David Turell,
2016-12-03, 00:32
- An inventive mechanism: A DNA 'Shapiro change' -
dhw,
2016-12-02, 10:37
- An inventive mechanism: A DNA 'Shapiro change' -
David Turell,
2016-12-01, 19:09
- An inventive mechanism: A DNA 'Shapiro change' -
dhw,
2016-12-01, 13:13
- An inventive mechanism: A DNA 'Shapiro change' -
David Turell,
2016-11-30, 15:38
- An inventive mechanism: A DNA 'Shapiro change' -
dhw,
2016-11-30, 12:23
- An inventive mechanism: A DNA 'Shapiro change' -
David Turell,
2016-11-29, 19:37
- An inventive mechanism: A DNA 'Shapiro change' -
dhw,
2016-11-29, 09:03
- An inventive mechanism: A DNA 'Shapiro change' -
David Turell,
2016-11-27, 15:23
- An inventive mechanism: role of horizontal gene transfer -
dhw,
2014-12-04, 17:49
- An inventive mechanism: role of horizontal gene transfer -
David Turell,
2014-12-03, 22:17
- An inventive mechanism: role of horizontal gene transfer -
dhw,
2014-12-03, 18:00
- An inventive mechanism: role of horizontal gene transfer -
David Turell,
2014-12-02, 17:40
- An inventive mechanism: role of horizontal gene transfer -
dhw,
2014-12-01, 17:28
- An inventive mechanism: role of horizontal gene transfer -
David Turell,
2014-12-01, 00:58
- An inventive mechanism: role of horizontal gene transfer -
dhw,
2014-11-30, 19:52
- An inventive mechanism: role of horizontal gene transfer -
David Turell,
2014-11-29, 15:49
- An inventive mechanism: role of horizontal gene transfer - David Turell, 2014-12-01, 15:29
- An inventive mechanism: role of horizontal gene transfer -
dhw,
2014-11-29, 11:57
- An inventive mechanism: role of horizontal gene transfer -
David Turell,
2014-11-28, 15:41
- An inventive mechanism -
dhw,
2014-09-02, 20:50
- An inventive mechanism -
dhw,
2014-09-01, 13:01
- An inventive mechanism -
dhw,
2014-08-30, 12:29