Panpsychism Makes a Comeback (General)

by dhw, Sunday, January 25, 2015, 20:34 (3371 days ago) @ David Turell

DAVID: My position is that only animals with a central nervous system, a brain or ganglia may have some limited form of intelligence mainly at the instinct level. However, there is a gradation of intelligence based on how advanced they are: lobsters, insects, worms, etc. show less intelligent activity than ,say, crows, apes, whales, or dolphins.-And indeed that gradation continues upwards to human beings, who have a far greater degree of intelligence! But your position seems vulnerable to me. We need to define our terms, as do the participants in the bacteria discussion. If by intelligence we mean cognition, sentience, processing information, ability to communicate and act upon the exchange of information, decision-making, problem-solving, individuality even to the point of self-awareness (and Shapiro uses that very term, which you say is “Just fine with me”), there can scarcely be any justification for excluding bacteria from the ranks of the “intelligent”.
 
dhw: I find the concept of a “semi-autonomous” IM extremely unsatisfactory, unless we confine the non-autonomous area to its possible source being your God, and to the fact that it cannot exceed its own natural limitations or those imposed by the environment - a restriction that applies to all intelligences including ours. Otherwise, either organisms can make changes to themselves (autonomy) or they can't.-DAVID: I can conceive of an IM which has inventive limits, in which it can only go so far in self-modification from the original form or process. That is what I have always meant as semi-autonomous. Sorry to have been obtuse.-That is what I mean by it being unable to exceed its own natural limitations, and it's an important step in our discussion. Perhaps we can now do away altogether with the idea of your God giving half a set of instructions to the weaverbird on how to build its nest. Once we accept the proposal that organisms have their own form of intelligence and can take their own decisions accordingly, we can move on to the question of how evolution functions. Evolution is Chapter 2 in life's history, and here I am not trying to solve the problem of Chapter 1 (the origin of life and whatever mechanisms it entails). Nobody knows how single cells managed to combine into multicellularity or how multicellular organisms managed to produce the colossal array of innovations that have led to the different forms of life we now know. For some reason, innovation appears to have ceased for the time being. All we can observe is adaptation. Adaptation leaves life forms more or less as they were and fits in perfectly with the condition you have stipulated: in other words the mechanism for adaptation is autonomous (self-modification does not go beyond the original form).-Now, however, comes the key phrase in your definition. The IM can only go “so far” in its self-modification. If we believe in common descent, ALL innovations must take place in existing organisms, and since even single cells are believed by some experts to be “intelligent” (see above for a list of the attributes required), the inventive mechanism MAY go “so far” as to produce its own innovations. A finned organism may decide to go on land, and its fins may become legs. A legged organism may decide to climb trees, and its top pair of limbs may become arms. An armed organism may decide to pick fruit, and its paws may become hands. These changes will happen quickly, because otherwise they won't be effective, but they can be improved on and varied by the intelligent mechanisms of succeeding generations. Does this sound too magical? What are the alternatives? Random mutations; God preprogramming the first living cells with every single mutation to be passed down through billions of organisms; God intervening to manipulate each change in each individual organism. Since we have no explanation, evolution does seem like a kind of magic - and it's not just humans but life itself and all its different forms that are against all odds. As an explanation of the events in Chapter 2 of life's history, I don't see an autonomous IM as being any more "magical" than those alternatives.