DILEMMAS (Evolution)

by dhw, Monday, November 03, 2014, 22:31 (3671 days ago) @ David Turell

GK: One step closer you get. I would expect a biologist to use the word. Now address the "fact" that there is not one example of less complex forming more complex.-DAVID: This is exactly correct. What GK is referring to are the gaps. All the fossils for complex organisms appear out of nowhere, fully functional. Because we see life go from simple to complex and the fossils are progressive by age, we presume a mechanism of evolution occurred. As Tony has just pointed out, evolution is a thoery, not a fact. My presumption may be wrong. It may be God stepping in all along the way.-GK: I think evolution seems to work just like the rock record and experiments shows it works. [...] I do not see "more complex" arising from "less complex"; anywhere. So I move on. "Old guy in the sky", well, That makes more assumptions than a star makes neutrino's. If we continue to argue these two "end points" the rift will never close in our lifetimes.-I find all this very confusing. GK, if you think evolution works progressively, as shown by the rock record, single cells must have led to multicellularity, and complex organisms must have sprung from less complex. Your comment about the “old guy in the sky” suggests you are not a believer in God (though maybe, like me, not a disbeliever either), which would suggest you don't believe in separate creation. Perhaps you could clarify whether you do or don't think all forms of life (except the first) have sprung from earlier forms.
 
Of course Tony is right, and evolution is a theory not a fact. But until now, David, you have always argued for theistic evolution. There is a level at which discussion becomes impossible, since NOTHING is known (see the thread on epistemology), but your comment was anticipated in my original response to GK:
 
Dhw: I don't know your views on evolution, GK, and am beginning to wonder if I know David's, but if you believe in the theory that all living organisms except the very first descended from earlier living organisms, you are looking at examples every waking moment of your life. The question then is not whether, but how complex comes from less complex.-**********-I had drafted a reply to the posts in which David summarizes his position on evolution, and Tony (under “Contingent evolution”) offers a “third way”. However, David's endorsement of Tony's position also requires an answer, and I will try to combine all the points tomorrow.