Natural Wonders & Evolution (Evolution)

by David Turell @, Monday, September 23, 2019, 19:16 (371 days ago) @ dhw

dhw: I am not questioning your God’s “works” but I am questioning your interpretation of his reasoning. I believe you are as human as I am, so do please tell me in your own human way why wanting total control is not “humanizing” but wanting only partial control is “humanizing”. If you can’t, then please say so, and we can move on.

I view God as an all-powerful non-human Being considering what He has created. Why should He give up any of his control? He also is fully purposeful in reaching His goals.

DAVID: I don't guess. I simply accept what God chose to do as demonstrated in the history of events. And later: ….nothing you suggest can be proven, so it is all woolly guesswork. Accept history as God's work. I do.

dhw: We agree on the history of events: there is a universe, there is Planet Earth, there is life, and life began with single cells and evolved into multicellular organisms, of which we are the latest and – with our special degree of consciousness – the most complex. If God exists, it was all his doing. The comment to which you have replied, now bolded, is the area of your woolly guesswork with no real substance.

DAVID: You forget, with faith, we accept God's work as God's work. We can only guess at His reasoning. You are perfectly describing my God and find it irrational, which is just your problem and why you are an agnostic.

dhw: YOU find it irrational, because you have no idea why your God would choose such a method to achieve the purpose you impose on him! This has nothing to do with my agnosticism, since the rational alternatives I offer are all theistic!

You keep calling my thoughts as irrational. I don't find them that way. The God you attempt to describe in your supposed theism mode is just a humanized form who acts irrationally.

DAVID (under “feedback loops”): I find nothing illogical in my theories. Pretending that I do is silly. It does not advance our discussion. (dhw’s bold)

dhw: I have also bolded your theory above, and you say to me: “Haven’t you realized by now, I have no idea why God chose to evolve humans over time.” In that case, you cannot possibly find it logical. Indeed, you even go so far as to say that God’s logic must be different from human logic!

I don't try to find God's choice of method as logical or illogical. I simply accept His choice.

DAVID: Same tired mantra: I don't try to guess at God's reasoning. And I do fully feel His choice was logical and reasonable for Him. As you humanize god, you don't.

dhw: Same tired mantra. Nothing to do with humanizing God. YOU cannot understand his logic (“have no idea”), so once more, how can you possibly claim that you find nothing illogical in your theories, and how do you know that your God does not think in a way that would be logical and reasonable to us humans? This is indeed a tired mantra because so far you have never answered either question.

I don't try to understand His logic, as it is all guesses. That is logical. That is an answer.

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