By FRANS de WAAL: refuted (Introduction)
dhw:Intelligence is not to be gauged by how far apes can adopt human language and culture! If a human expects an ape to behave like a human in order to show its intelligence, maybe the human is not as intelligent as he thinks he is. Perhaps the reviewer should initiate a conversation with Alex in Alex’s own language, and then maybe he’d have a different story to tell.
Some language! Chimps have about 30 'sounds' but use sign language and body language to communicate:
http://www.conservenature.org/learn_about_wildlife/chimpanzees/chimp_communication.htm
dhw: I don’t know of any scientist who claims that our fellow animals have the same level of intelligence, let alone self-awareness as humans. Horses think like horses, apes think like apes, ants think like ants. But time after time, scientists demonstrate the intelligence of other organisms by setting them problems which can only be solved by intelligent thought – you have drawn our attention to many such tests. Yes, humans can train their fellow animals. That doesn’t mean that their fellow animals in the wild don’t have the intelligence to communicate with one another, cooperate with one another, devise ways of life that suit themselves, solve problems that nature throws at them, and in the context of animal societies create systems that work a darn sight better than our own.
You are correct, animals are more independent and we as humans are interdependent. Their thoughts shows intentionality. Introspection, no.
Complete thread:
- By FRANS de WAAL on animal cognition -
David Turell,
2016-04-09, 16:12
- By FRANS de WAAL on animal cognition -
dhw,
2016-04-10, 14:09
- By FRANS de WAAL on animal cognition -
David Turell,
2016-04-11, 01:02
- By FRANS de WAAL on animal cognition -
dhw,
2016-04-11, 13:30
- By FRANS de WAAL on animal cognition -
David Turell,
2016-04-11, 15:41
- By FRANS de WAAL on animal cognition -
dhw,
2016-04-12, 14:52
- By FRANS de WAAL on animal cognition -
David Turell,
2016-04-12, 16:15
- By FRANS de WAAL on animal cognition -
dhw,
2016-04-13, 12:27
- By FRANS de WAAL on animal cognition -
David Turell,
2016-04-13, 15:07
- By FRANS de WAAL on animal cognition -
dhw,
2016-04-14, 15:49
- By FRANS de WAAL on animal cognition -
David Turell,
2016-04-14, 17:44
- By FRANS de WAAL on animal cognition -
dhw,
2016-04-15, 14:20
- By FRANS de WAAL on animal cognition -
David Turell,
2016-04-15, 16:11
- By FRANS de WAAL on animal cognition -
dhw,
2016-04-16, 09:19
- By FRANS de WAAL on animal cognition -
David Turell,
2016-04-16, 15:59
- By FRANS de WAAL on animal cognition -
dhw,
2016-04-17, 13:06
- By FRANS de WAAL on animal cognition -
David Turell,
2016-04-17, 15:17
- By FRANS de WAAL on animal cognition -
dhw,
2016-04-18, 14:05
- By FRANS de WAAL on animal cognition -
David Turell,
2016-04-18, 18:11
- By FRANS de WAAL on animal cognition -
dhw,
2016-04-19, 13:26
- By FRANS de WAAL on animal cognition -
David Turell,
2016-04-19, 15:24
- By FRANS de WAAL on animal cognition -
dhw,
2016-04-20, 12:44
- By FRANS de WAAL on animal cognition -
David Turell,
2016-04-20, 19:09
- By FRANS de WAAL on animal cognition -
dhw,
2016-04-21, 13:41
- By FRANS de WAAL on animal cognition -
David Turell,
2016-04-22, 02:46
- By FRANS de WAAL on animal cognition -
dhw,
2016-04-22, 15:05
- By FRANS de WAAL on animal cognition -
David Turell,
2016-04-22, 19:37
- By FRANS de WAAL on animal cognition -
dhw,
2016-04-23, 13:09
- By FRANS de WAAL on animal cognition - David Turell, 2016-04-23, 15:57
- on animal cognition. A thoughtful essay -
David Turell,
2016-12-09, 01:37
- on animal cognition. A thoughtful essay -
dhw,
2016-12-09, 18:00
- on animal cognition. A thoughtful essay -
David Turell,
2016-12-09, 19:10
- on animal cognition. honey bee math skills -
David Turell,
2019-02-14, 23:38
- on animal cognition. cockatoos use multiple tools - David Turell, 2023-02-11, 18:50
- on animal cognition: do animals have consciousness -
David Turell,
2019-08-29, 23:47
- on animal cognition: do animals have consciousness -
dhw,
2019-08-30, 09:59
- on animal cognition: do animals have consciousness - David Turell, 2019-08-30, 16:43
- on animal cognition: do animals have consciousness -
dhw,
2019-08-30, 09:59
- on animal cognition. honey bee math skills -
David Turell,
2019-02-14, 23:38
- on animal cognition. A thoughtful essay -
David Turell,
2016-12-09, 19:10
- on animal cognition. A thoughtful essay -
dhw,
2016-12-09, 18:00
- By FRANS de WAAL on animal cognition -
dhw,
2016-04-23, 13:09
- By FRANS de WAAL on animal cognition -
David Turell,
2016-04-22, 19:37
- By FRANS de WAAL on animal cognition -
dhw,
2016-04-22, 15:05
- By FRANS de WAAL on animal cognition -
David Turell,
2016-04-22, 02:46
- By FRANS de WAAL on animal cognition -
dhw,
2016-04-21, 13:41
- By FRANS de WAAL on animal cognition -
David Turell,
2016-04-20, 19:09
- By FRANS de WAAL on animal cognition -
dhw,
2016-04-20, 12:44
- By FRANS de WAAL: refuted -
David Turell,
2016-05-29, 15:58
- By FRANS de WAAL: refuted -
dhw,
2016-05-30, 09:23
- By FRANS de WAAL: refuted -
David Turell,
2016-05-30, 15:12
- By FRANS de WAAL: refuted -
dhw,
2016-05-31, 13:26
- By FRANS de WAAL: refuted -
David Turell,
2016-06-01, 01:43
- By FRANS de WAAL: more comment -
David Turell,
2016-06-11, 21:28
- By FRANS de WAAL: more comment from him - David Turell, 2016-06-30, 17:32
- By FRANS de WAAL: refuted -
David Turell,
2016-11-09, 17:23
- By FRANS de WAAL: refuted -
dhw,
2016-11-10, 13:14
- By FRANS de WAAL: refuted -
David Turell,
2016-11-10, 21:01
- By FRANS de WAAL: refuted -
dhw,
2016-11-11, 11:46
- By FRANS de WAAL: refuted -
David Turell,
2016-11-11, 15:04
- By FRANS de WAAL: refuted -
dhw,
2016-11-12, 12:40
- By FRANS de WAAL: refuted -
David Turell,
2016-11-12, 18:33
- By FRANS de WAAL: refuted -
dhw,
2016-11-13, 13:17
- By FRANS de WAAL: refuted -
David Turell,
2016-11-13, 21:16
- By FRANS de WAAL: refuted -
dhw,
2016-11-14, 12:12
- By FRANS de WAAL: refuted -
David Turell,
2016-11-14, 17:57
- By FRANS de WAAL: refuted -
dhw,
2016-11-15, 14:01
- By FRANS de WAAL: refuted -
David Turell,
2016-11-15, 20:20
- By FRANS de WAAL: refuted -
dhw,
2016-11-16, 12:26
- By FRANS de WAAL: refuted -
David Turell,
2016-11-16, 20:20
- By FRANS de WAAL: refuted -
dhw,
2016-11-17, 12:40
- By FRANS de WAAL: refuted -
David Turell,
2016-11-17, 19:54
- FRANS de WAAL: language and cognition -
David Turell,
2017-01-14, 15:47
- FRANS de WAAL: language and cognition -
dhw,
2017-01-15, 11:51
- FRANS de WAAL: language and cognition -
David Turell,
2017-01-15, 15:30
- FRANS de WAAL: language and cognition -
David Turell,
2019-05-27, 18:38
- FRANS de WAAL: language and cognition -
dhw,
2019-05-28, 09:50
- FRANS de WAAL: language and cognition - David Turell, 2019-05-28, 18:10
- FRANS de WAAL: language and cognition -
dhw,
2019-05-28, 09:50
- FRANS de WAAL: language and cognition -
David Turell,
2019-05-27, 18:38
- FRANS de WAAL: language and cognition -
David Turell,
2017-01-15, 15:30
- FRANS de WAAL: language and cognition -
dhw,
2017-01-15, 11:51
- FRANS de WAAL: language and cognition -
David Turell,
2017-01-14, 15:47
- By FRANS de WAAL: refuted -
David Turell,
2016-11-17, 19:54
- By FRANS de WAAL: refuted -
dhw,
2016-11-17, 12:40
- By FRANS de WAAL: refuted -
David Turell,
2016-11-16, 20:20
- By FRANS de WAAL: refuted -
dhw,
2016-11-16, 12:26
- By FRANS de WAAL: refuted -
David Turell,
2016-11-15, 20:20
- By FRANS de WAAL: refuted -
dhw,
2016-11-15, 14:01
- By FRANS de WAAL: refuted -
David Turell,
2016-11-14, 17:57
- By FRANS de WAAL: refuted -
dhw,
2016-11-14, 12:12
- By FRANS de WAAL: refuted -
David Turell,
2016-11-13, 21:16
- By FRANS de WAAL: refuted -
dhw,
2016-11-13, 13:17
- By FRANS de WAAL: refuted -
David Turell,
2016-11-12, 18:33
- By FRANS de WAAL: refuted -
dhw,
2016-11-12, 12:40
- By FRANS de WAAL: refuted -
David Turell,
2016-11-11, 15:04
- By FRANS de WAAL: refuted -
dhw,
2016-11-11, 11:46
- By FRANS de WAAL: refuted -
David Turell,
2016-11-10, 21:01
- By FRANS de WAAL: refuted -
dhw,
2016-11-10, 13:14
- By FRANS de WAAL: more comment -
David Turell,
2016-06-11, 21:28
- By FRANS de WAAL: refuted -
David Turell,
2016-06-01, 01:43
- By FRANS de WAAL: refuted -
dhw,
2016-05-31, 13:26
- By FRANS de WAAL: refuted -
David Turell,
2016-05-30, 15:12
- By FRANS de WAAL: refuted -
dhw,
2016-05-30, 09:23
- By FRANS de WAAL on animal cognition -
David Turell,
2016-04-19, 15:24
- By FRANS de WAAL on animal cognition -
dhw,
2016-04-19, 13:26
- By FRANS de WAAL on animal cognition -
David Turell,
2016-04-18, 18:11
- By FRANS de WAAL on animal cognition -
dhw,
2016-04-18, 14:05
- By FRANS de WAAL on animal cognition -
David Turell,
2016-04-17, 15:17
- By FRANS de WAAL on animal cognition -
dhw,
2016-04-17, 13:06
- By FRANS de WAAL on animal cognition -
David Turell,
2016-04-16, 15:59
- By FRANS de WAAL on animal cognition -
dhw,
2016-04-16, 09:19
- By FRANS de WAAL on animal cognition -
David Turell,
2016-04-15, 16:11
- By FRANS de WAAL on animal cognition -
dhw,
2016-04-15, 14:20
- By FRANS de WAAL on animal cognition -
David Turell,
2016-04-14, 17:44
- By FRANS de WAAL on animal cognition -
dhw,
2016-04-14, 15:49
- By FRANS de WAAL on animal cognition -
David Turell,
2016-04-13, 15:07
- By FRANS de WAAL on animal cognition -
dhw,
2016-04-13, 12:27
- By FRANS de WAAL on animal cognition -
David Turell,
2016-04-12, 16:15
- By FRANS de WAAL on animal cognition -
dhw,
2016-04-12, 14:52
- By FRANS de WAAL on animal cognition -
David Turell,
2016-04-11, 15:41
- By FRANS de WAAL on animal cognition -
dhw,
2016-04-11, 13:30
- By FRANS de WAAL on animal cognition -
David Turell,
2016-04-11, 01:02
- animal cognition: smart orangutans - David Turell, 2018-11-09, 20:38
- By FRANS de WAAL on animal cognition -
dhw,
2016-04-10, 14:09