BELIEF is not complicated. (Introduction)

by Cary Cook , Monday, June 02, 2008, 01:56 (6017 days ago) @ dhw

I have to split this because it was too long. - >Point 1) Cary says that if there is a "just" afterlife, ethics will be the basis of our pleasure/displeasure ratio, and duration of life will depend on rewards and punishments. - You got the second part wrong. I said this: 
Duration of life will necessarily be sustained until all just payments are made ... both rewards & punishments.
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>I didn't know that there was limited "duration" in the Christian concept of a possible afterlife, but maybe you can expound on this later. - Christian concepts of an afterlife are irrelevant to anything we've said so far.
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>I still don't understand why you should think a just God's ethics will be different from your own, - Where did I say anything that would imply that?
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>I find your use of "involuntary" misleading. (Misunderstandings so often come down to different interpretations of individual words.) For me, this does not simply entail independence from the will, but also a lack of consciousness and control, - I'm trying to clarify existing concepts. Different interpretations of individual words is one of the things we must get beyond in the effort to clarify concepts. We're not talking about what a word is for me or for you or for anybody. We're talking about what a concept is ... in this case, the concept "involuntary", which is different from the concept "subconscious". 
Involuntary means not controlled by the will. An involuntary act may be totally involuntary (e.g. heartbeat, digestion, reflex actions) or partially involuntary in the sense of being delayable, but not preventable (e.g. breathing, burping, farting). 
Some acts are sometimes involuntary and sometimes preventable (sneezing, coughing, vomiting). Yes, we may be unconscious of an involuntary act like heartbeat & digestion, but being unconscious of it is not what makes an act involuntary. Not controlling it is what makes it involuntary. Subconscious acts can be voluntary or involuntary.
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>Would it not be clearer to say that JUDGMENT OF PROBABILITY is independent of the will? - If that does it for you, you're welcome to it. But I wouldn't change my essay to match that, because I think it will cause more problems than it solves. Somebody might rightly ask me what judgment of probability is. If I take your advice, the conversation might go like this:
ME: Judgment of probability is independent of the will.
HIM: I didn't ask you what it's independent of; I asked you what it is.
ME: It is a mental act.
HIM: You mean like thinking, perceiving, and emoting?
ME: Specifically it's a thought.
HIM: You mean like adding numbers?
ME: No. I said it's independent of the will.
HIM: You mean it's an involuntary mental act?
ME: Yeah.
HIM: Would it not be clearer to say that?