How children pick up a language: new review of Wolfe (Humans)
DAVID: Thank you. Human are different in kinds, not degree.
dhw:I always feel a bit guilty when you raise this issue, because it is so central to your concept of evolution and it is so unimportant in my own. Forget kind versus degree just for a moment. I acknowledge the vast mental gap between us and all other species, and in my evolutionary hypothesis (theistic version), I can even allow for divine dabbling. What I cannot allow for is the claim that your God specially designed all other forms of life and natural wonders extant and extinct for no other purpose than to pave the way for humans. That seems to be the only reason for your preoccupation with the distinction, and that is our sticking point.
My more direct answer would have to be: humans, chimps, chickens, dolphins and ants are all different in kind. So are their languages, and so are their consciousnesses, unless you believe a chimp thinks like a chicken like a dolphin etc. etc. However, although all of these are conscious in their own different ways, I believe humans have additional degrees of consciousness which make them almost incalculably more aware of themselves and of the world around them than any other organism. Similarly a dog’s sense of smell is vastly more sensitive than a human’s. “More aware”, “more sensitive” are terms that denote degree, but the degree can be part of the difference in kind that distinguishes all species (broad sense). In materialist terms, if the human brain is different in kind from the dog’s brain, the dog’s nose is different in kind from the human nose. For me, your (Adler’s) attempted distinction between degree and kind leads nowhere.
That is not my point at all. Adler's book The Difference of Man and the Difference It Makes assumes Evolution is true and that evolution always shows differences in small degree as it advances toward the more complex, except in the case of humans. It is a long philosophic, not a theological argument taken from scientific findings as of 1966, that humans are uniquely different, not by degree, but totally different in kind, with introspective and conceptual consciousness, a jump not explained by evolution. Adler, born Jewish, died a Catholic and was a philosophic advisor to the Church. My comments about degree and kind are either not understood by you or you are trying to use the word 'kind' in a different context than in which I use it. I suggest you read his book. It has a powerful argument that we are very, very special, and allows one to conclude we are special creation.
Complete thread:
- Chomsky's book & human language -
dhw,
2016-04-02, 13:43
- Chomsky's book & human language -
David Turell,
2016-04-02, 16:33
- Chomsky's book & human language -
dhw,
2016-04-03, 13:51
- Chomsky's book & human language -
David Turell,
2016-04-03, 15:40
- How children may pick up a language -
David Turell,
2016-05-07, 22:39
- How children may pick up a language -
dhw,
2016-05-09, 13:05
- How children may pick up a language - David Turell, 2016-05-09, 15:28
- How children pick up a language: another study -
David Turell,
2016-06-07, 16:27
- How children pick up a language: not instinct -
David Turell,
2016-06-11, 19:13
- How children pick up a language: not instinct -
dhw,
2016-06-12, 12:42
- How children pick up a language: not instinct - David Turell, 2016-06-12, 21:20
- How children pick up a language: defending Chomsky -
David Turell,
2016-07-24, 23:59
- How children pick up a language: denying Chomsky -
David Turell,
2016-08-28, 00:30
- How children pick up a language: denying Chomsky -
dhw,
2016-08-28, 16:21
- How children pick up a language: denying Chomsky 2 -
David Turell,
2016-09-07, 22:43
- How children pick up a language: denying Chomsky 2 -
dhw,
2016-09-08, 12:30
- How children pick up a language: denying Chomsky 2 -
David Turell,
2016-09-08, 21:15
- How children pick up a language: denying Chomsky 2 -
dhw,
2016-09-09, 13:03
- How children pick up a language: denying Chomsky 2 -
David Turell,
2016-09-09, 15:31
- How children pick up a language: denying Chomsky 2 -
dhw,
2016-09-10, 12:59
- How children pick up a language: denying Chomsky 2 -
David Turell,
2016-09-10, 16:35
- How children pick up a language: denying Chomsky 2 -
dhw,
2016-09-11, 13:09
- How children pick up a language: denying Chomsky 2 -
David Turell,
2016-09-11, 15:10
- How children pick up a language: denying Chomsky 2 -
dhw,
2016-09-12, 12:15
- How children pick up a language: denying Chomsky 2 -
David Turell,
2016-09-12, 18:06
- How children pick up a language: denying Chomsky 2 -
dhw,
2016-09-13, 11:46
- How children pick up a language: denying Chomsky 2 -
David Turell,
2016-09-14, 02:07
- How children pick up a language: denying Chomsky 2 -
dhw,
2016-09-14, 12:34
- How children pick up a language: denying Chomsky 2 -
David Turell,
2016-09-14, 16:16
- How children pick up a language: denying Chomsky 2 -
dhw,
2016-09-15, 12:44
- How children pick up a language: denying Chomsky 2 -
David Turell,
2016-09-15, 19:13
- How children pick up a language: Review of Wolfe -
David Turell,
2016-10-12, 18:12
- How children pick up a language: new review of Wolfe -
David Turell,
2016-10-21, 21:57
- How children pick up a language: new review of Wolfe -
dhw,
2016-10-23, 08:32
- How children pick up a language: new review of Wolfe -
David Turell,
2016-10-23, 20:36
- How children pick up a language: new review of Wolfe -
dhw,
2016-10-24, 13:14
- How children pick up a language: new review of Wolfe -
David Turell,
2016-10-24, 15:50
- How children pick up a language: new review of Wolfe -
dhw,
2016-10-25, 12:31
- How children pick up a language: new review of Wolfe -
David Turell,
2016-10-25, 15:24
- How children pick up a language: new review of Wolfe -
dhw,
2016-10-26, 12:26
- How children pick up a language: new review of Wolfe -
David Turell,
2016-10-26, 15:15
- How children pick up a language: new review of Wolfe -
dhw,
2016-10-27, 10:28
- How children pick up a language: new review of Wolfe -
David Turell,
2016-10-27, 19:20
- How children pick up a language: new review of Wolfe -
dhw,
2016-10-28, 12:46
- How children pick up a language: new review of Wolfe -
David Turell,
2016-10-28, 14:41
- How children pick up a language: new review of Wolfe -
dhw,
2016-10-29, 13:14
- How children pick up a language: new review of Wolfe -
David Turell,
2016-10-30, 00:37
- How children pick up a language: new review of Wolfe -
dhw,
2016-10-30, 12:10
- How children pick up a language: new review of Wolfe -
David Turell,
2016-10-30, 14:10
- How children pick up a language: new review of Wolfe -
dhw,
2016-10-31, 11:47
- How children pick up a language: new review of Wolfe -
David Turell,
2016-10-31, 17:03
- How children pick up a language: new review of Wolfe -
dhw,
2016-11-01, 14:28
- How children pick up a language: new review of Wolfe -
David Turell,
2016-11-01, 17:53
- How children pick up a language: new review of Wolfe -
dhw,
2016-11-02, 13:09
- How children pick up a language: new review of Wolfe -
David Turell,
2016-11-02, 19:57
- How children pick up a language: new review of Wolfe -
dhw,
2016-11-03, 11:30
- How children pick up a language: new review of Wolfe -
David Turell,
2016-11-03, 18:01
- How children pick up a language: new review of Wolfe -
dhw,
2016-11-04, 13:04
- How children pick up a language: new review of Wolfe -
David Turell,
2016-11-04, 17:31
- How children pick up a language: new review of Wolfe -
dhw,
2016-11-05, 12:21
- How children pick up a language: new review of Wolfe -
David Turell,
2016-11-05, 14:11
- How children pick up a language: new review of Wolfe -
dhw,
2016-11-06, 13:19
- How children pick up a language: new review of Wolfe -
David Turell,
2016-11-06, 14:57
- How children pick up a language: new review of Wolfe -
dhw,
2016-11-07, 13:44
- How children pick up a language: new review of Wolfe -
David Turell,
2016-11-07, 17:26
- How children pick up a language: new review of Wolfe -
dhw,
2016-11-08, 12:07
- How children pick up a language: new review of Wolfe -
David Turell,
2016-11-08, 14:41
- How children pick up a language: new review of Wolfe -
dhw,
2016-11-09, 13:10
- How children pick up a language: new review of Wolfe -
David Turell,
2016-11-09, 14:42
- How children pick up a language: new review of Wolfe -
dhw,
2016-11-10, 13:01
- How children pick up a language: new review of Wolfe -
David Turell,
2016-11-10, 21:16
- How children pick up a language: new review of Wolfe -
dhw,
2016-11-11, 12:00
- How children pick up a language: new review of Wolfe -
David Turell,
2016-11-11, 15:30
- How children pick up a language: new review of Wolfe -
dhw,
2016-11-12, 12:46
- How children pick up a language: new review of Wolfe -
David Turell,
2016-11-12, 15:40
- How children pick up a language: new review of Wolfe -
dhw,
2016-11-13, 13:12
- How children pick up a language: new review of Wolfe -
David Turell,
2016-11-13, 19:40
- How children pick up a language: new review of Wolfe -
dhw,
2016-11-14, 12:07
- How children pick up a language: new review of Wolfe -
David Turell,
2016-11-14, 17:44
- How children pick up a language: new review of Wolfe -
dhw,
2016-11-15, 13:53
- How children pick up a language: new review of Wolfe -
David Turell,
2016-11-15, 20:12
- How children pick up a language: new review of Wolfe -
dhw,
2016-11-16, 12:19
- How children pick up a language: new review of Wolfe -
David Turell,
2016-11-16, 20:04
- How children pick up a language: new review of Wolfe -
dhw,
2016-11-17, 12:33
- How children pick up a language: new review of Wolfe -
David Turell,
2016-11-17, 19:51
- How children pick up a language: new review of Wolfe -
dhw,
2016-11-18, 12:36
- How children pick up a language: new review of Wolfe -
David Turell,
2016-11-18, 14:54
- How children pick up a language: new review of Wolfe -
dhw,
2016-11-19, 12:17
- How children pick up a language: new review of Wolfe -
David Turell,
2016-11-19, 19:16
- How children pick up a language: new review of Wolfe -
dhw,
2016-11-20, 12:08
- How children pick up a language: new review of Wolfe -
David Turell,
2016-11-20, 15:10
- How children pick up a language: new review of Wolfe -
dhw,
2016-11-21, 12:35
- How children pick up a language: new review of Wolfe -
David Turell,
2016-11-21, 15:35
- How children pick up a language: new review of Wolfe -
dhw,
2016-11-22, 12:08
- How children pick up a language: new review of Wolfe -
David Turell,
2016-11-22, 14:16
- How children pick up a language: new review of Wolfe -
dhw,
2016-11-23, 12:20
- How children pick up a language: new review of Wolfe -
David Turell,
2016-11-23, 14:13
- How children pick up a language: new review of Wolfe -
dhw,
2016-11-24, 13:21
- How children pick up a language: new review of Wolfe - David Turell, 2016-11-24, 15:09
- How children pick up a language: new review of Wolfe -
dhw,
2016-11-24, 13:21
- How children pick up a language: new review of Wolfe -
David Turell,
2016-11-23, 14:13
- How children pick up a language: new review of Wolfe -
dhw,
2016-11-23, 12:20
- How children pick up a language: new review of Wolfe -
David Turell,
2016-11-22, 14:16
- How children pick up a language: new review of Wolfe -
dhw,
2016-11-22, 12:08
- How children pick up a language: new review of Wolfe -
David Turell,
2016-11-21, 15:35
- How children pick up a language: new review of Wolfe -
dhw,
2016-11-21, 12:35
- How children pick up a language: new review of Wolfe -
David Turell,
2016-11-20, 15:10
- How children pick up a language: new review of Wolfe -
dhw,
2016-11-20, 12:08
- How children pick up a language: new review of Wolfe -
David Turell,
2016-11-19, 19:16
- How children pick up a language: new review of Wolfe -
dhw,
2016-11-19, 12:17
- How children pick up a language: new review of Wolfe -
David Turell,
2016-11-18, 14:54
- How children pick up a language: new review of Wolfe -
dhw,
2016-11-18, 12:36
- How children pick up a language: new review of Wolfe -
David Turell,
2016-11-17, 19:51
- How children pick up a language: new review of Wolfe -
dhw,
2016-11-17, 12:33
- How children pick up a language: new review of Wolfe -
David Turell,
2016-11-16, 20:04
- How children pick up a language: new review of Wolfe -
dhw,
2016-11-16, 12:19
- How children pick up a language: new review of Wolfe -
David Turell,
2016-11-15, 20:12
- How children pick up a language: new review of Wolfe -
dhw,
2016-11-15, 13:53
- How children pick up a language: new review of Wolfe -
David Turell,
2016-11-14, 17:44
- How children pick up a language: new review of Wolfe -
dhw,
2016-11-14, 12:07
- How children pick up a language: new review of Wolfe -
David Turell,
2016-11-13, 19:40
- How children pick up a language: new review of Wolfe -
dhw,
2016-11-13, 13:12
- How children pick up a language: new review of Wolfe -
David Turell,
2016-11-12, 18:27
- How children pick up a language: Pinker's view -
David Turell,
2016-11-30, 22:42
- How children pick up a language: Pinker's view -
dhw,
2016-12-01, 13:22
- How children pick up a language: Pinker's view -
David Turell,
2016-12-01, 19:21
- How children pick up a language: Pinker's view -
dhw,
2016-12-02, 10:42
- How children pick up a language: Pinker's view -
David Turell,
2016-12-03, 00:48
- How children pick up a language: Pinker's view -
dhw,
2016-12-03, 13:41
- How children pick up a language: Pinker's view -
David Turell,
2016-12-03, 14:40
- How children pick up a language: Pinker's view -
dhw,
2016-12-04, 12:16
- How children pick up a language: Everett's view -
David Turell,
2017-01-10, 14:49
- How children pick up a language: Everett's view - dhw, 2017-01-11, 12:24
- How children pick up a language: Everett's view -
David Turell,
2017-01-10, 14:49
- How children pick up a language: Pinker's view -
dhw,
2016-12-04, 12:16
- How children pick up a language: Pinker's view -
David Turell,
2016-12-03, 14:40
- How children pick up a language: Pinker's view -
dhw,
2016-12-03, 13:41
- How children pick up a language: Pinker's view -
David Turell,
2016-12-03, 00:48
- How children pick up a language: Pinker's view -
dhw,
2016-12-02, 10:42
- How children pick up a language: Pinker's view -
David Turell,
2016-12-01, 19:21
- How children pick up a language: new comment -
David Turell,
2017-03-05, 00:09
- How children pick up a language: new comment -
dhw,
2017-03-05, 13:43
- How children pick up a language: new comment -
David Turell,
2017-03-05, 18:18
- How children pick up a language: new comment -
Balance_Maintained,
2017-03-05, 21:33
- How children pick up a language: new comment -
David Turell,
2017-03-06, 00:45
- How children pick up a language: new comment - Balance_Maintained, 2017-03-06, 01:23
- How children pick up a language: new comment -
David Turell,
2017-03-06, 00:45
- How children pick up a language: new comment - dhw, 2017-03-06, 12:53
- How children pick up a language: new comment -
Balance_Maintained,
2017-03-05, 21:33
- How children pick up a language: new comment -
David Turell,
2017-03-05, 18:18
- How children pick up a language: new comment -
David Turell,
2017-07-17, 19:47
- How children pick up a language: new comment -
David Turell,
2017-08-01, 22:41
- How children pick up a language: new comment -
dhw,
2017-08-02, 14:17
- How children pick up a language: new comment -
David Turell,
2017-08-02, 19:50
- How children pick up a language: new comment -
dhw,
2017-08-03, 10:57
- How children pick up a language: new comment - David Turell, 2017-08-03, 14:59
- How children pick up a language: new comment -
dhw,
2017-08-03, 10:57
- How children pick up a language: new comment -
David Turell,
2017-08-02, 19:50
- How children pick up a language: new comment -
dhw,
2017-08-02, 14:17
- How children pick up a language: new study re words - David Turell, 2019-01-30, 23:03
- How children pick up a language: eight month old baby study -
David Turell,
2020-03-13, 14:55
- How children pick up a language: both sides used early -
David Turell,
2020-09-08, 00:51
- How children pick up a language: Danish is difficult -
David Turell,
2021-06-28, 17:43
- How children pick up a language: Chomsky supported -
David Turell,
2021-08-28, 15:05
- How children pick up a language: fetal speech -
David Turell,
2024-07-25, 19:16
- How children pick up a language: latest review - David Turell, 2024-08-22, 19:01
- How children pick up a language: fetal speech -
David Turell,
2024-07-25, 19:16
- How children pick up a language: Chomsky supported -
David Turell,
2021-08-28, 15:05
- How children pick up a language: Danish is difficult -
David Turell,
2021-06-28, 17:43
- How children pick up a language: both sides used early -
David Turell,
2020-09-08, 00:51
- How children pick up a language: new comment -
David Turell,
2017-08-01, 22:41
- How children pick up a language: new comment -
dhw,
2017-03-05, 13:43
- How children pick up a language: Pinker's view -
dhw,
2016-12-01, 13:22
- How children pick up a language: Pinker's view -
David Turell,
2016-11-30, 22:42
- How children pick up a language: new review of Wolfe -
David Turell,
2016-11-12, 15:40
- How children pick up a language: new review of Wolfe -
dhw,
2016-11-12, 12:46
- How children pick up a language: new review of Wolfe -
David Turell,
2016-11-11, 15:30
- How children pick up a language: new review of Wolfe -
dhw,
2016-11-11, 12:00
- How children pick up a language: new review of Wolfe -
David Turell,
2016-11-10, 21:16
- How children pick up a language: new review of Wolfe -
dhw,
2016-11-10, 13:01
- How children pick up a language: new review of Wolfe -
David Turell,
2016-11-09, 14:42
- How children pick up a language: new review of Wolfe -
dhw,
2016-11-09, 13:10
- How children pick up a language: new review of Wolfe -
David Turell,
2016-11-08, 14:41
- How children pick up a language: new review of Wolfe -
dhw,
2016-11-08, 12:07
- How children pick up a language: new review of Wolfe -
David Turell,
2016-11-07, 17:26
- How children pick up a language: new review of Wolfe -
dhw,
2016-11-07, 13:44
- How children pick up a language: new review of Wolfe -
David Turell,
2016-11-06, 14:57
- How children pick up a language: new review of Wolfe -
dhw,
2016-11-06, 13:19
- How children pick up a language: new review of Wolfe -
David Turell,
2016-11-05, 14:11
- How children pick up a language: new review of Wolfe -
dhw,
2016-11-05, 12:21
- How children pick up a language: new review of Wolfe -
David Turell,
2016-11-04, 17:31
- How children pick up a language: new review of Wolfe -
dhw,
2016-11-04, 13:04
- How children pick up a language: new review of Wolfe -
David Turell,
2016-11-03, 18:01
- How children pick up a language: new review of Wolfe -
dhw,
2016-11-03, 11:30
- How children pick up a language: new review of Wolfe -
David Turell,
2016-11-02, 19:57
- How children pick up a language: new review of Wolfe -
dhw,
2016-11-02, 13:09
- How children pick up a language: new review of Wolfe -
David Turell,
2016-11-01, 17:53
- How children pick up a language: new review of Wolfe -
dhw,
2016-11-01, 14:28
- How children pick up a language: new review of Wolfe -
David Turell,
2016-10-31, 17:03
- How children pick up a language: new review of Wolfe -
dhw,
2016-10-31, 11:47
- How children pick up a language: new review of Wolfe -
David Turell,
2016-10-30, 14:10
- How children pick up a language: new review of Wolfe -
dhw,
2016-10-30, 12:10
- How children pick up a language: new review of Wolfe -
David Turell,
2016-10-30, 00:37
- How children pick up a language: new review of Wolfe -
dhw,
2016-10-29, 13:14
- How children pick up a language: new review of Wolfe -
David Turell,
2016-10-28, 14:41
- How children pick up a language: new review of Wolfe -
dhw,
2016-10-28, 12:46
- How children pick up a language: new review of Wolfe -
David Turell,
2016-10-27, 19:20
- How children pick up a language: new review of Wolfe -
dhw,
2016-10-27, 10:28
- How children pick up a language: new review of Wolfe -
David Turell,
2016-10-26, 15:15
- How children pick up a language: new review of Wolfe -
dhw,
2016-10-26, 12:26
- How children pick up a language: new review of Wolfe -
David Turell,
2016-10-25, 15:24
- How children pick up a language: new review of Wolfe -
dhw,
2016-10-25, 12:31
- How children pick up a language: new review of Wolfe -
David Turell,
2016-10-24, 15:50
- How children pick up a language: new review of Wolfe -
dhw,
2016-10-24, 13:14
- How children pick up a language: new review of Wolfe -
David Turell,
2016-10-23, 20:36
- How children pick up a language: new review of Wolfe -
dhw,
2016-10-23, 08:32
- How children pick up a language: new review of Wolfe -
David Turell,
2016-10-21, 21:57
- How children pick up a language: Review of Wolfe -
David Turell,
2016-10-12, 18:12
- How children pick up a language: denying Chomsky 2 -
David Turell,
2016-09-15, 19:13
- How children pick up a language: denying Chomsky 2 -
dhw,
2016-09-15, 12:44
- How children pick up a language: denying Chomsky 2 -
David Turell,
2016-09-14, 16:16
- How children pick up a language: denying Chomsky 2 -
dhw,
2016-09-14, 12:34
- How children pick up a language: denying Chomsky 2 -
David Turell,
2016-09-14, 02:07
- How children pick up a language: denying Chomsky 2 -
dhw,
2016-09-13, 11:46
- How children pick up a language: denying Chomsky 2 -
David Turell,
2016-09-12, 18:06
- How children pick up a language: denying Chomsky 2 -
dhw,
2016-09-12, 12:15
- How children pick up a language: denying Chomsky 2 -
David Turell,
2016-09-11, 15:10
- How children pick up a language: denying Chomsky 2 -
dhw,
2016-09-11, 13:09
- How children pick up a language: denying Chomsky 2 -
David Turell,
2016-09-10, 16:35
- How children pick up a language: denying Chomsky 2 -
dhw,
2016-09-10, 12:59
- How children pick up a language: denying Chomsky 2 -
David Turell,
2016-09-09, 15:31
- How children pick up a language: denying Chomsky 2 -
dhw,
2016-09-09, 13:03
- How children pick up a language: denying Chomsky 2 -
David Turell,
2016-09-08, 21:15
- How children pick up a language: denying Chomsky 2 -
dhw,
2016-09-08, 12:30
- How children pick up a language: denying Chomsky 2 -
David Turell,
2016-09-07, 22:43
- How children pick up a language: denying Chomsky -
dhw,
2016-08-28, 16:21
- How children pick up a language: denying Chomsky -
David Turell,
2016-08-28, 00:30
- How children pick up a language: not instinct -
dhw,
2016-06-12, 12:42
- How children pick up a language: not instinct -
David Turell,
2016-06-11, 19:13
- How children may pick up a language -
dhw,
2016-05-09, 13:05
- How children may pick up a language -
David Turell,
2016-05-07, 22:39
- Chomsky's book & human language -
David Turell,
2016-04-03, 15:40
- Chomsky's book & human language -
dhw,
2016-04-03, 13:51
- Chomsky's book & human language -
David Turell,
2016-04-02, 16:33