Human Consciousness: how we observe (Humans)

by David Turell , Wednesday, August 17, 2016, 19:23 (3018 days ago) @ dhw


> dhw: If one does not have a body, one does not need a brain. To sum it up, NDEs seem to suggest that consciousness does NOT require a brain to be received, and that is precisely the reason why they are cited as evidence for dualism (and also for life after death).- Your conclusions are not van Lommel's. I don't follow your reasoning at all; in these cases a brain is still part of an unconscious body; see Sam Parnia (the current leading researcher) below and my comment:-http://www.express.co.uk/news/science/670781/There-IS-life-after-DEATH-Scientists-reveal-shock-findings-from-groundbreaking-study-"LIFE after death has been "confirmed" by scientists who have discovered consciousness continues even once a person has died.-"In a large scale study of more than 2,000 people, British boffins confirmed that thoughts DO carry on after the heart stops.-"The shock research has also uncovered the most convincing evidence of an out of body experience for a patient declared dead.-"It had been believed the brain stopped all activity 30 seconds after the heart had stopped pumping blood around the body, and that with that, awareness ceases too.-"However, the study from the University of Southampton shows people still experience awareness for up to three minutes after they had been pronounced dead.-***-"Of the 2,060 patients from Austria, the US and the UK interviewed for the study who had survived cardiac arrest, almost 40 per cent said that they recall some form of awareness after being pronounced clinically dead.-"Dr Parnia continued: "This suggests more people may have mental activity initially but then lose their memories after recovery, either due to the effects of brain injury or sedative drugs on memory recall.”-"Of those who said they had experienced some awareness, just two per cent said their experience was consistent with the feeling of an outer body experience - where one feels completely aware and can hear and see what's going on around them after death.-"Almost half of the respondents said the experience was not of awareness, but rather of fear.-"However, the most significant finding of the study is that of a 57-year old man who is perhaps the first confirmed outer body experience in a patient. (my bold)-***-"The man was able to recall with eerie accuracy what was going on around him after he had ‘died' temporarily. -"Dr Parnia continued: "This is significant, since it has often been assumed that experiences in relation to death are likely hallucinations or illusions occurring either before the heart stops or after the heart has been successfully restarted, but not an experience corresponding with 'real' events when the heart isn't beating.-"In this case, consciousness and awareness appeared to occur during a three-minute period when there was no heartbeat. -“'This is paradoxical, since the brain typically ceases functioning within 20-30 seconds of the heart stopping and doesn't resume again until the heart has been restarted. -“'Furthermore, the detailed recollections of visual awareness in this case were consistent with verified events.'"-Comment: Note my bold. In van Lommel's study there was a man who came into the ER and while totally unconscious, had his false teeth removed for intubation and later knew where the teeth were by identifying the nurse who took them. van Lommel considers the possibility that there are lower brain centers that stay active. Parnia's study is prospective; all patients have EEG's running as soon as the patient arrives, and all who survive are immediately interviewed. Another point is that in an adult (20 years old or more) the brain dies in four minutes. That is why resuscitation is carried out so quickly. Parnia's 3-minute-finding fits the facts.