Free Will, Consciousness, Identity (Identity)

by romansh , Saturday, July 28, 2012, 20:33 (4500 days ago) @ romansh

Again this long dhw
> I'm not offering it as a defence of free will (and I don't agree that we end up with solipsism!). I'm saying that until we know the source of consciousness, we cannot dismiss the concept of free will (by my definition) as you appear to do.-Whether we are conscious or not is irrelevant - unless you are pointing to something supernatural similar to a god's ability be independent. If so then there is little point in this discussion.
 -> Until you explain the argument that makes it a non sequitur, I don't understand your use of the term. Freedom certainly makes sense to me, though that doesn't mean we have it! I feel that under normal circumstances, when I'm required to make a conscious decision, "I" am in control of the process leading to that decision. In similar fashion, when "I" try to remember something, "I" search my memory. I have no idea what part of "me" gives me the ability to rack my brain, but it is the same element of my identity that gives me the ability to weigh up the pros and cons before taking my decision ... namely, a layer of consciousness that exercises control over those areas of my mind to which I have conscious access. (In Matt's terms, this refers to those thoughts that come when I will, and not when they will.) I'm not prepared to dismiss this ability as an illusion just because it and the various choices would not exist if the universe did not exist.-Whether determinism is true, indeterminism is true or some combination. None of these give us free will. That is why free will is a non sequitur.-I can't explain it better than that dhw.